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New Push For Helmet Laws

Fri, Nov 22, 2013

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New Push For Helmet Laws

The helmet law debate, now in its 47th year, is starting to heat up again. In the last month the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and the British Magazine The Economist have editorialized for a national, mandatory helmet law for motorcycle riders. Yesterday a Republican Congressman from Michigan named Tim Walberg accused the CDC of trying “to reduce the use of motorcycles – a legal mode of transportation.”

The original helmet laws were a result of the National Highway Safety Act of 1966, which was passed in response to the publication of Ralph Nader’s book, Unsafe At Any Speed published the year before. Helmet laws were almost an afterthought in that bill which mandated the standardization of bumper heights, safer gas tanks, padded dashboards, collapsible steering wheels and factory installed seat belts. Forty-nine states had helmet laws by 1975. The lone holdout was California which led the nation in motorcycle registrations.

The original intent of that 1966 law was to reduce traffic fatalities. Most states repealed their helmet laws because, as a Michigan appeals court put it, the “logic” used to justify helmet laws “could lead to unlimited paternalism.” The current campaign for mandatory helmet laws is that riding without a helmet presents an unacceptable risk for insurers.

The Economist

In its editorial in the United States print edition published November 16, The Economist argued, “When states repeal or weaken motorcycle-helmet laws, as dozens have, helmet use falls, fatalities rise and head-injury hospitalizations soar. Biker deaths rose 18 percent after Michigan repealed its all-rider helmet law in 2012. A rule obliges un-helmeted Michigan riders to carry at least $20,000 in medical-payments coverage. That does not even cover initial stabilization in intensive care after a nasty crash.”

The editorial continued, “Libertarians often demand: ‘Let those who ride decide,’ says Jacqueline Gillan, who heads Advocates for Highway and Auto Safety, an insurer-funded lobby group. Her retort is: ‘Let those who pay have a say.’”

The Economist noted that this is a partisan issue. Most helmet law opponents are Republicans. An important Republican Congressman named Tom Petri wants the CDC “to stop researching motorcycle safety” because he thinks the Centers have “an anti-motorcycle agenda.” Most opponents of helmet laws in state legislatures are also Republicans. So it’s not surprising that Walberg, a long time rider and a member of both the American Motorcyclist Association and the Congressional Motorcycle Caucus takes issue with the CDC’s most recent hymn to mandatory helmet use, a report published late last month titled, “Motor Vehicle Related Injury Prevention: Economic Impact of Motorcycle Helmet Laws.”

The CDC

The CDC thinks mandatory helmet laws reduce health care costs – which is a subject of much fevered debate in Washington these days. As a matter of fact, all motor vehicle crashes are responsible for a little less than two percent of all American health costs and motorcycle crashes represent a tiny percentage of that.

But the CDC and The Economist agree that it is very expensive to survive a catastrophic bike crash. The British magazine alleges that helmetless riders in major crashes “typically run up $1.3m in direct medical costs” and that “fewer than a third work again.” The CDC study argues that taxpayers are stuck with paying 63 percent of the cost of the aftermath of these accidents.

So there is obviously going to be a push this winter to enact a nationwide helmet law. You just haven’t heard about it on your local news yet.

 

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64 Comments For This Post

  1. Tidesfalls Says:

    “Unlimited paternalism”, is a very appropriate assessment. Too bad that most people do not even know what that means, and even less have paid attention to it since it was coined.
    This is the perfect example of an over staffed government justifying their jobs by making issues where none exist. Less than 2% – really?

  2. 11c_infantry Says:

    Like everything else the gub-ment gets involved in, this isn’t really about the safety of the serfs…errrr…I mean the people. This is about control, pure and simple. To paraphrase an old gun-rights saying, “I’ll wear a helmet when they shove it on my cracked dead skull.” I’m a grown man and don’t need big daddy gub-ment to protect me.

    L&R to those who earned it,
    11c
    SOTSFFSOTS

  3. Meh Says:

    Notice these paternalist fucks don’t dare target smokers and the obese, though the mortality and morbidity from those conditions together and separately dwarf bike losses. They’d get spanked by the market if they did.

    Piss on the insurance industry lobbyists. The industry is free to set rates and terms for riders who don’t wear helments, but they don’t because that would mean leaving money on the table for the competition!

    Of course all insurors have access to actuarial stats, which means all this is, is an attempt to reduce payouts even further since lobbying for new laws costs near nothing. If they couldn’t fucking afford to write motorcycle policies they wouldn’t offer motorcycle policies since they are not required to do so.

  4. jj solari Says:

    the job of government is to order people around. they’re doing their job. i dont know why everyone is complaining.

  5. CN Says:

    I lived and learned and went over the high side in NYS where they had helmet laws then moved to SC in ’99 where they don’t. If I ride into GA or NC I need to put on a DOT approved helmet or risk an equipment violation. If they really want to be dicks about it they can go as far as to impound my bike until I can show up, pay the storage and show that I have the DOT helmet so I seldom go there except to pass through on the way to somewhere else because, and I know this sounds selfish and abusive to all those people out there who think my BC/BS health insurance isn’t enough to cover any sort of motorcycle accident which results in injury, even though it is, on a warm sunny day or worse in the heat of the summer that brain bucket is just too fucking hot and unfuckingcomfortable. I do favor wearing one in hail storms however. Really fucked up weather usually brings out my inner helmetism. I can take it or leave it. A full face does allow for a certain amount of annonimity which is why up North they sometimes allow the Clubs an exception at funerals so that they can update their photo files. I pay a lot of fucking money for health insurance and if I engage in lawful/risky behavior I’m still not costing the general public any fucking thing. Being a daily rider regardless of the weather here in SC and the surrounding States a greater danger to my health is the careless cagers who in some cases are guilty of premeditated attempted murder, the ones who say, I never saw the motorcycle. 9 out of 10 times these worthless fucks walk and never see the inside of a court room unless its Civil Court. I can fit a full face helmet in the trunk of the tour pack on the Electra Glde / Garbage Wagon/ Geezer Glide so 99% of the time ones packed in there. I-95 is my drug of choice more times than not and the traffic flow is 80-85 mph. At that speed I dont care if youre wearing a fucking suit of armour, you ass is grass. Oddly enough though, the majority of my friends whove been in life altering near death wrecks have been rear ended at stop lights and cagers who turn left without any warning, if the helmet debate was legit the majority of near fatal wrecks would be head on into stationary objects (yeah I kmow its deer season). Weve all worn those fake novelty helmets and some of us have bought DOT stickers at swap meets but the chincy straps break and you end up either 86′ing the thing or slinging it over an arm until the next oppurtunity to get another one especially in a pack. I’ve collected my fail share of equipment violation tickets, I pay em’ cause I know I’ll be back that way in the future and an outstanding ticket isnt in my best interest. I can however think of one ntional mandatory requirement for all Bikers helmets or not, namely, that everyone should be an organ doner which we can do here at the DMV. Every cager should also be an organ doner as well as every train and bus rider. People who fly can be excused I guess because if they go down there usually isnt a whole lot left or so one would think. I dont fly. So theres the compromise, if everyone who uses motorized transportation will become 100% organ doners I’d consider a nation wide helmet law.
    Hearts, Kidneys, Eyes to name a few are always in short ass supply and this would increase the potential pool to eradicate the need. Imagine that! Sounds like a great idea for the good of the collective and much better than the results of a manditory national helmet law. Lets see how the citizens react to that one! Im sure they wont mind at all being they want us to wear helmets for purely financial reasons (that dont exist). Maybe some clever polition could write that legislation and send it through the gauntlet to our President who can do no wrong. Its not like his poll numbers could get any lower. So there you have it, manditory nationwide helmet laws for manditory nation wide 100% organ doners for all mechanized forms of travel. Get back to me when the cagers, bus and train riders and hell, throw in bicycle riders and joggers too agree. These fuckers have got to be causing more woes for the poor insurance companies than scooter trash like me and those like me. Wait, if they dont like that then how about universal helmet laws for all people engaged in motorized land travel. Buy a KIA, get a free helemt! PS. Really sorry about the spelling lately, I’ve lost spell check for some odd reason. L&R Always.

  6. Freeman Says:

    Governmom, all over the world its governmom, remember being five and asking your mom why? the answer was cause i said so! Thats how they see us, a retarded 5 year old that cant think for himself and needs to be protected from himself, everything you think (and it should be)is a right is becoming a privilege, with every fuckin year that passes by, more rules and regulations make rights become privileges, and more and more of these so called privileges come with a price, a permit that you have to pay for that issues a piece of paper that says you paid for that privilege, and if you dont pay for that privilege and do it anyway and get caught, they issue another piece of paper in the form of a fine thats 3 time the amount the permit would have cost you, or they make you give some liberties to access that privilege

    If you live in a city, taking a shit is taxed, they have water meters installed on the main water line to your house calculating how many gallons of water you consume in a year and tax you on that consumption.

    I moved out of the city and live in a lil village, my water comes from a well on MY land, energy is electricity, and 2/3 third of my consumption i produce my self via eolian and solar panels, and i charged the government for the installation via a deduction on my tax report and save taxes i would have to pay on the energy i produce myself, would love to be 100% independent its coming, has much as i can i hunt my food save that much taxes and i know my deer steak isn’t filled with chemicals,antibiotics and growth hormone, might seem extreme to some people but all these things keeps governmom out of my business, at least part of it.

  7. Road Whore Says:

    @ Freeman:

    Amen, and good on ya!

    Ride Free

  8. Sieg Says:

    Required…Mandatory…Shall Possess…Must Have.

    Fuck it all.

    Fuck helmets.

    Fuck headlights.

    Fuck insurance.

    Fuck organ-donors.

    Fuck yo mama.

    If you told me that it was a nationwide, mandatory, must-have requirement that I smoke some large dope, screw three beautiful ladies at once, and have a fleet of primo Knuckles in my garage, all free-o-charge, I’d STIL say FUCK YOU!

    You’re free or your not. There is no halfway, and as soon as you say “well, you’re free, but I want THIS to be mandatory, then you’ve screwed the pooch, there is no freedom.

    And all this shit about what it costs to care for someone after an accident is bullshit. How much is spent on hormones and “gender-reassignment” surgery for tranny inmates every year? Bet a donut it’s more than all that’s spent to help people went down on their sleds.

    Hey-it’s a beautiful day to die. If the powers that be don’t want to spend the money to fix me up if I lunch, DON’T. I give a shit. When you are born, you are given so many hours here…all the coddling in the world won’t buy you another minute.

    FTF/FTP/FTW
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  9. Snow Says:

    Down here in La. we have a mandatory law but it’s pretty liberal in interpretation and the fine’s $ 50 including all court fees.
    The group I ride with established a mandatory full face rule a couple years ago after a few accidents. I’m pro choice but ok with the rule cause I choose to ride with them.
    Wishing all the regulars a Happy Thanksgiving, remember the reason for the season.
    Support Your Local
    FTF. ACAB.
    Snow

  10. Bill Says:

    Fuck headlights?

  11. Metal Dave Says:

    “If you told me that it was a nationwide, mandatory, must-have requirement that I smoke some large dope, screw three beautiful ladies at once, and have a fleet of primo Knuckles in my garage, all free-o-charge, I’d STIL say FUCK YOU!”

    Well, let’s not get carried away ! (I hear ya)

  12. YYZ Skinhead Says:

    When I wear a full-face helmet it is damn hard to see and hear. Pete Wilson was a Republican but he rammed that fucking CA helmet law up California’s collective ass. My queendom for an independent, libertarian (not Libertarian Party) governor who can repeal that body-Nazi legislation.

    YYZ Skinhead

  13. CN Says:

    It’s still America so the Gods know we all got the right to say what’s on our minds and some of us went so far as to join up or were drafted and showed up, so that even those who’s opinions we disagree with or find repugnant can say whatever they believe to be their truth. However, red flags always go up for me when the solution to every problem is extreme violence which is voiced with total disrespect and less class than a turtle on a fence post. We had a saying in the Corps that went “Is this the hill you want to die on” which meant, not all situations call for a balls to the walls responce. Maybe the author is bitter or perhaps has psychological issues of which they have no real control, it’s an unknown. But if every comment on every topic is “lock & load” and they actually believe that then they’d be deader than Elvis long ago. I was talking last night with a wrench at the local H-D Dealership about the new 500-750 cc models and he seemed impressed and he’s a man who isn’t easy to impress, so instead of arguing the point I listened and learned. The easy/lazy way would have been to put down anything under 1000cc especially when a few decades ago I was an avid quarter mile drag strip rider every Saturday night. But I honestly didn’t know very much about the new scoots so I kept my big yap shut and by the end of the conversation had a better grasp of the subject matter. The knowledge I gained made me, I guess, smarter or at least more informed. If, on the other had my responce had been “fuck that, fuck you, I got a gun” not only would I have lost his respect (give it to get it) but would have made a complete asshole out of myself for no reason whatsoever. It just wasn’t the hill I thought worthy to die on. Chances are the “fuck that, fuck you, I got a gun” show is a trick bag to see who else will jump on board, maybe get an email address and strike up a convo on the side then when and if the kindred soul gets real, pay them a visit in the wee hours with the rest of the SWAT team. I get the feeling that a sincere “Happy Thanksgiving” to this sort would get the full treatment which is sad because some of us really wish those with whom we interact, even here, are surrounded by friends and family for all the good vibes a gathering like that can bring. I don’t hang out in bars much anymore unless the Chapter are all going there but I can remember back when I did, if you came across the “fuck that, fuck you, I got a gun” guy he usually got a wide berth and ended up 86′ed before too long. Most of the truly hardest men I’ve ever come across are friendly and don’t take themselves too damned seriously. Rarely is the public badass really anything to be feared. The calmly self assured guy who is quick to shake hands and meet you is also the guy you’d be well advised not to mess with. The loud mouth attention seeker usually can’t back up the mouth. Anybody who’s only broken record line always deals with guns or dope is often a trap (I hate calling somebody I truly don’t know a cop but I’m running out of alternatives). Hell, we all lose it from time to time and say shit we’d like to take back but if that’s an all the time gig, man something ain’t right. I’m very passionate about individual freedoms and the never ending helmet debate has been near the top of my list for decades but it’s not that hill. When everything is that hill, something

  14. CN Says:

    It’s still America so the Gods know we all got the right to say what’s on our minds and some of us went so far as to join up or were drafted and showed up, so that even those who’s opinions we disagree with or find repugnant can say whatever they believe to be their truth. However, red flags always go up for me when the solution to every problem is extreme violence which is voiced with total disrespect and less class than a turtle on a fence post. We had a saying in the Corps that went “Is this the hill you want to die on” which meant, not all situations call for a balls to the walls responce. Maybe the author is bitter or perhaps has psychological issues of which they have no real control, it’s an unknown. But if every comment on every topic is “lock & load” and they actually believe that then they’d be deader than Elvis long ago. I was talking last night with a wrench at the local H-D Dealership about the new 500-750 cc models and he seemed impressed and he’s a man who isn’t easy to impress, so instead of arguing the point I listened and learned. The easy/lazy way would have been to put down anything under 1000cc especially when a few decades ago I was an avid quarter mile drag strip rider every Saturday night. But I honestly didn’t know very much about the new scoots so I kept my big yap shut and by the end of the conversation had a better grasp of the subject matter. The knowledge I gained made me, I guess, smarter or at least more informed. If, on the other had my responce had been “fuck that, fuck you, I got a gun” not only would I have lost his respect (give it to get it) but would have made a complete asshole out of myself for no reason whatsoever. It just wasn’t the hill I thought worthy to die on. Chances are the “fuck that, fuck you, I got a gun” show is a trick bag to see who else will jump on board, maybe get an email address and strike up a convo on the side then when and if the kindred soul gets real, pay them a visit in the wee hours with the rest of the SWAT team. I get the feeling that a sincere “Happy Thanksgiving” to this sort would get the full treatment which is sad because some of us really wish those with whom we interact, even here, are surrounded by friends and family for all the good vibes a gathering like that can bring. I don’t hang out in bars much anymore unless the Chapter are all going there but I can remember back when I did, if you came across the “fuck that, fuck you, I got a gun” guy he usually got a wide berth and ended up 86′ed before too long. Most of the truly hardest men I’ve ever come across are friendly and don’t take themselves too damned seriously. Rarely is the public badass really anything to be feared. The calmly self assured guy who is quick to shake hands and meet you is also the guy you’d be well advised not to mess with. The loud mouth attention seeker usually can’t back up the mouth. Anybody who’s only broken record line always deals with guns or dope is often a trap (I hate calling somebody I truly don’t know a cop but I’m running out of alternatives). Hell, we all lose it from time to time and say shit we’d like to take back but if that’s an all the time gig, man something ain’t right. I’m very passionate about individual freedoms and the never ending helmet debate has been near the top of my list for decades but it’s not that hill. Hope all y’all have a great Thanksgiving. Remember the BHC if you can. A card or letter during the Holidays is a very cool thing to do. L&R Always.

  15. Ipsick Says:

    The rhetoric of what motorcycle accidents cost the tax payers got the helmet law pass in California. The insurance companies bank rolled Dick Floyd’s election, he got the law passed and then ABATE of California work their asses off and got him voted out next time he was up for re election

    Problem was/is, the insurance companies auto policy holder were the ones causing all the motorcycle accidents.

  16. Snow Says:

    YYZ
    I thought it would be tough getting used to them but surprisingly not, purchased a modular and never looked back.
    Support Your Local
    FTF ACAB
    Snow

  17. Sieg Says:

    Bill, once upon a time, before NHTSA and the other AlphaSoup buttboys got involved, running a headlight was NOT mandatory, except when it was dark.

    Some sniveling about “keeping people safe”, some shady insurance-racket studies, and voila! You not only hafta run with a light in most-maybe all, I’m not sure-states, but vehicles are sold with lights linked into the ignition.

    I’m sure things have changed a tad in the decades since I lived n rode in and around el-Lay, but back then, we ran dental mirrors taped to the left bar, Schwinn coaster brakes on ten inch front wheels, and if ya hit a state with a lid-law, ya strapped a surplus issue-helmet to yer knee and went like that.

    Things have changed…

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  18. Sieg Says:

    Metal Dave, yeah, a garage full-o-free Knuckles…I guess I got a tad carried away!

    Thing is, seems like a lotta the “incremental” crowd always have “just one thing” they want to make mandatory. And it’s usually just like slipping the head in.

    My whole point was once upon a time, people trusted other people to make the right decisions for themselves, because they were RIGHT, not because someone said they had to.

    And if anyone doesn’t like that opinion, well, that’s their prerogative. They may be happier with someone telling them what to do, and who am I to tell them they can’t be?!

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  19. Bill Says:

    Sieg: Thanks

  20. CN Says:

    Amazing how much one can appear to know first hand by reading old books and watching old movies. Even more amazing how the tone of the bat shit can calm down when called on their BS. Its an amazing day all around eh?

  21. Freeman Says:

    Talk about insurance, look out for this if its not in your area yet, its coming.

    Tracking device installed on your vehicle that collects data, position information, travel speed, acceleration etc…

    Right now its not mandatory you ask for it and if you really ride/drive like a freaking nun they will knock off some small percentage off your payments.

    Now its not mandatory but you can sure hear insurance lobbyists pushing for it, and governmom would just love to know your whereabouts at all times, they probably already have a set percentage fixed, when xx% of the driving license owner population uses it, they will push for it, and before long it will be mandatory.

  22. Sieg Says:

    Freeman, the Oligarchs are going to keep pushing any and everything they can to keep the leash on. Insurance is mandatory in Illinois and Wisconsin now, and the talk of broadcasting your vehicles speed and location is the prelude to controlling them.

    Commonly used police riot agent, if you feel you have a beef with someone, grow a set and spit it out.

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  23. Nags Says:

    If its all about protecting people from themselves they’d be further ahead and save more $ requiring helmets in cars. Not saying I want that but it if it was solely about safety which anyone with a half a brain knows its about $ that’s the route they’ll be heading next.

  24. YYZ Skinhead Says:

    Snow,

    Where did you get yours? The ome I have feels like my head is caught in a Tin Cat rat trap.

    YYZ Skinhead

  25. Glenn S. Says:

    If they required the Great American Soccer Mom, that most revered of useless entity, to wear helmets, there would be a barrier between the side of their heads and the cell phone. Better still, a mandatory jamming device that disables the cell phone inside minivans and SUVs. And, while we’re at it, those miniature tanks and road yachts they drive around in, from one retail outlet to the next, jockeying for position by changing lanes every twenty feet without signalling, are not very good for the environment or the supply/demand of gas. Ban ‘em. The same nanny government logic applies.

    But wait, its not about the good of the many bullshit. Its about targeting society’s despised classes and using paternalism as an excuse.

    Read a book when I was a kid called “The Devil’s Advocate”. The totalitarian government was defeated only because the resistance infiltrated government and targeted the favored classes with the same petty rules and unjust acts applied to everybody else. Not that that would work here and now. Nobody with imagination and original thought could ever get their foot in the door of today’s political machine.

  26. Glenn S. Says:

    YYZ Skinhead said: The ome I have feels like my head is caught in a Tin Cat rat trap.

    I have an Outlaw brand low profile carbon fiber half helmet in flat black, that I wear when I leave South Carolina. I ordered it by googleing “low profile helmets” a year or so back. Unfortunately, I received a “safety recall notice” on the helmet, so I’m guessing the ones with the imbedded DOT logo are no longer available.

    When I was looking for such a helmet, I went by the Barnyard Flea Market on Hwy. 101, outside Greer, SC. There was a booth where biker gear was sold. I had been there once before, and the attendant tried to sell me a vest. He whipped out his pistol from his own similar vest, as if to show me that one could be effectively carried and hidden, but I was struck with the thought that what he really was after was for me to whip out my own piece to one-up him. As a law-abiding felon, I had no pistol so couldn’t do so. Friends later told me that he’d done the same thing when they had been there. (If I’ve already told this story before, feel free to ignore it).

    Anyway, when I was looking for the helmet, a different guy was manning the booth, and he wore a vest that, from the front, looked like colors from an MC or (more likely) RC that I hadn’t seen before. I asked about a DOT approved low profile half helmet. He said he didn’t carry them and that they were unsafe. I told him that I just wanted to be as legal as I had to be in Georgia and NC and asked if he knew where one was available locally. He told me that “an officer” he knew of in Georgia carried micrometers and a scale to insure that helmets not only had DOT logos, but were DOT compliant in size and weight. I remarked that if some cop had the time to be so petty, the taxpayers were obviously funding too many cops. He then turned around and showed me that his patch included “LEMC”.

    I still wear the helmet, figuring that I could probably beat the charge in court if I happen to encounter this petty little pig, and I’m not all that likely to encounter the one pig with mikes and triple beams on him. Does anybody know whether or not an embedded DOT logo is a legal defense against the charge of an improper helmet? (The OL wears the non-low-profile kind, and if pulled over, I’d squeeze my head into hers for long enough to go and buy another one, but I truly hate wearing all that weight on my head.)

  27. YYZ Skinhead Says:

    Glenn S,

    Oh shit man, these fucking pig clubs, playing biker but–ta daa!–magically metamorphosing into pork when they encounter a real biker. Circe would be jealous.

    YYZ Skinhead

  28. Sieg Says:

    Glenn, as long as it has the DOT sticker, it SHOULD be okay. Should. You know how that works…piggies feel a tad froggy, and away you go.

    If you want to play with their heads a bit-and you’ve got the time to do it-check your state law to see if it requires wearing the helmet ON YOUR HEAD.

    This is a copy of the Missouri lid-law…

    “”. . . 2. Every person operating or riding as a passenger on any motorcycle or motor tricycle, as defined in section 301.010, RSMo, upon any highway of this state shall wear protective headgear at all times the vehicle is in motion. . . .” ”

    Note that it doesn’t say this “protective headgear” has to be on the head, just that it has to be worn. Way back when, we had some fun with that one, wearing helmets-it was a little unclear on what was “approved” back then-on our knees, elbows, whatever. Always got a ticket, sometimes got it tossed, always had fun with it.

    I’ve got an ancient half-helm I wear when I get south enough to have to, it’s got a (barely) legible DOT sticker, but for whatever reason, I’ve never been hassled whilst wearing it.

    My guess is that you could wear whatever, and if you get rousted by a pig that wants to sniff yer helmet, well, that’s just the excuse he’s using, and he’d be rousting ya anyhow. Remember the hack that kept track of who bought what on store day, so he could give em a chit for overage?!?!?!?!?

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  29. Paladin Says:

    Glenn S.,

    The helmet you wear is still available and is listed in the “DOT approved” section in the online store.

    http://www.leatherup.com/c/DOT-Approved-Helmets/2/1063.html

    Any cop that would challenge the legality of your helmet would have to articulate as to why he or she thought your helmet was NOT DOT approved. Unless a cop has taken a Department approved and DOT certified class (they don’t exist) that teaches officers how to determine the authenticity of a DOT approved motorcycle helmet, a cop isn’t going to be able to show “through training and experience”, which helmet is or isn’t DOT approved. This is especially true if the helmet in question has an embedded DOT sticker.

    Long May You Ride (to those that deserve to),

    Paladin

  30. Sieg Says:

    Been so long since I rode in a helmet-state I don’t rightly know what they look for, but if this is all it is, seems like a few minutes online and some clear, and you’re good.

    http://www.amazon.com/HELMET-DECALS-STICKER-WHITE-SHIPPING/dp/B009S9RFXY

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  31. One Eye Says:

    Here in the Great White North it is mandatory to wear a helmet. I have been down with a helmet that was deemed “illegal” and I’ve been down with no helmet at all; I’ve gotten up and walked away, albeit one time with a concussion. Ironically that was the time I was wearing the helmet. Was I glad I was wearing a helmet? Of course, but I still think that if it is not mandatory to have seat belts on a bus (especially a school bus) or wear a helmet while driving a convertible a government shouldn’t force anyone to wear anything they don’t want to wear.

    It seems to be the prevailing contention by those legislating the laws that “if those who pay should have a say.” Really? How many people die from cigarettes and sugar? Paladin is spot on. In January, I fought, and beat, a helmet ticket showing the ambiguity of the Ontario Highway Traffic Safety Act and DOT specs regarding helmets ie., thickness of the inner padding, the outer shell, the chin strap and a DOT sticker. I do wear a “legal” helmet now for reasons that are twofold: I live in a small town and having been ticketed once I am marked and I found a great, lightweight helmet that is a MVSS 218 DOT which is a standard that denotes helmets which are tested to destructive failure. It is a 3/4 helmet ala the 60s/70s style and is very lightweight and comfortable. If anyone is interested they are on Lick’s Cycles web site. For the record I have ridden many, many, many times helmet less, still do, and I dig doing so.

  32. Glenn S. Says:

    Some of my friends wear “novelty helmets” and maybe some have little round paper stickers with a loved one’s initials that happen to be “DOT”. None of them have gotten shit about them (yet) that I’m aware of. My main concern is not having my bike impounded in Podunk, Georgia and tossed on its side in some salvage yard while $300/day storage fees add up. Its why I left the baffles in my Vance and Hines. They wanna ticket me, I’ll bury them in a sea of paperwork and amuse myself for a relatively low cost.

    I generally like Republican politicians a little less than I like Democratic ones, the clap, cold, rainy days, victims’ rights advocates, and English peas. But I’ll make a sorta exception for Republican SC governor Nikki Haley, who vowed to veto any helmet law that reaches her desk.

  33. Latigo Morgan Says:

    CDC = Centers for Disease Control

    Since when is riding a bike a disease? When did not wearing a helmet become a disease?

    Why are they even looking at this?

    Perhaps they should change the name of their agency to Center for Control?

    Bastards.

  34. YYZ Skinhead Says:

    Wish I had one of them Stahlhelme like the photo.

    YYZ Skinhead

  35. Snow Says:

    YYZ
    I think it’s a Fulmer though I”m not certain. Got it at the Victory/Indian dealer near me, lots cheaper than H-D. Just gotta try on a bunch to find the one that fits right.
    Support Your Local
    FTF. ACAB
    Snow

  36. Sieg Says:

    YYZ, they do make ‘em, or at least close to ‘em. No clue about the company, or if they’re any good, but they do look good.

    Here ya go…$40 on sale!

    http://www.jafrum.com/Shop-By-Brand/HCI-115-German-Helmets/115Black

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  37. Sieg Says:

    Even got ‘em in chrome, for those full-dress occasions.

    http://www.jafrum.com/Shop-By-Brand/HCI-115-German-Helmets/115Black

    der grosse Wienerschnitzel would be so proud…

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  38. Charlie O Says:

    If Republicans are supposed to be so anti-helmet law, why does every state in the deep south (Republican through and through) have a mandatory helmet law except South Carolina? (you might could throw Florida in there, but only the panhandle is really “deep South”).

  39. Snow Says:

    Charlie O
    Not true Texas and Arkansas are also option states. La was also until the useless Democrat Gov. Blanco reinstated it as one of her first acts in office. We’ve had several bills in since but politicians being what they are tag on a bunch of crap to them.
    Truthfully I don’t believe it matters what party is in office, we’re going to get screwed.
    Support Your Local
    FTF. ACAB
    Snow

  40. Glenn S. Says:

    Charlie O said: “If Republicans are supposed to be so anti-helmet law, why does every state in the deep south (Republican through and through) have a mandatory helmet law except South Carolina?”

    IMHO, before getting all warm and fuzzy towards Republicans, it helps to note that when a criminal conviction is upheld that looks like a no-brainer for reversal, and when a government policy that trashes the Bill of Rights gets rubber stamped by the courts, the jurists involved are usually Republican appointees. Republicans have been the driving force behind the war on drugs, the victims rights movements, and a plethora of restrictive “Tough New Laws” aimed at controlling the masses to Keep You Safe. It was Ronald Reagan, not Bill Clinton, that determined that 18-21 year olds are old enough to die in a war, but not old enough to have a cold beer at the end of their day. Likewise, Reagan, Bush the first, and their minions are largely responsible for the exponential increase in per capita incarceration. Dick Cheney is the present go-to-guy in the private prisons industry that will, no doubt, result in even more of people like us spending the best years of their lives locked up. Bush II gave us an end run around the Bill of Rights in the name of the War on Terror, and I’m all but certain that the government will one day use those precedents against us and people we care about. And then there are the many Republicans who support and endevour to create a government that enforces religious rules.

    Not defending Democrats, the enemy of my enemy is not necessarily my friend when it comes to government, but I don’t see a Republican administration restoring the particular freedoms I care about.

  41. CN Says:

    Went to that website Sieg suggested and got a really cool looking German WWII style flat black allegedly DOT approved helmet which when it arrives will go straight to a guy we got locally who will put the Club’s logo on it and then when I’m tooling through NC/GA and all the other Police States which boarder ours (SC) hopefully I’ll be in “compliance” with what we do not contend with here in South Carolina. Glen is correct when he says that Nikki Haley is actually noticably pro-motorcycle. I would’nt call her pro-Biker or pro-MC but then no Governor truly is. Our ABATE deserves a lot of credit for this as they are very active at the State House. There might also exist a somewhat collective guilt complex which resulted from the Myrtle Beach anti-Bike Week problem a few years back. The Bike-tober-fest last month has been reported in Carolina Chrome as being the largest attendance ever, don’t know, won’t go but hope it’s true. Casualties like the Rat Hole and the Suck Bang & Blow still leave a bad taste in my mouth besides our Club doesn’t go there very much anymore and I seldom ride to events without the men I trust with my life, wouldn’t be very much fun without them. But hey Sieg, thanks for the tip on the website.

  42. Sieg Says:

    CN, never ordered anything from them, so caveat emptor. Let us know if the piece is any good.

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  43. YYZ Skinhead Says:

    Sieg,

    That is a damm good price for a new DOT-approved Stahlhelm. Thanks ffor the tip. In addition I am looking for a Pickelhaube, that I can wear, though not one made of leather. I collect and sometimes wear war memorabilia from the Revolutionary War to today.

    YYZ Skinhead

  44. Mike 184 Says:

    @CN

    Yeah, THe damned cops just load up around suck bang blow. Plus this year (Spring rally) one of our members was asked to leave. If he would put his cut in his saddle bag they would love to have him stay?!?!? He told them once he finished his beer (Which the just sold him) he would be on his way….. Strange how that place operates. 350 days out of the year the give no shits about colors.

    I fly my Beanie all over NC and don’t catch any crap about it, but that said we did get pulled coming back from an event. We got pulled in Ramseur (? podunk town) by a town cop. The only one he was after was my buddy. He said he was following to closely. We all stated that was how we ride. Next thig ya know he is checking his helmet, seized it cause it was illegal, and writes him like 4 tickets. He got out of all of them, but we had to make a call and get a freakin helmet down there…

  45. Sieg Says:

    YYZ, ya definitely wouldn’t want to wwear an original, even if ya could. Head sizes were a hella smaller when Pickelhauben were the rage. All of the originals I’ve handled have been size pinhead.

    That said, here is a nice repop. Kinda plain, but well-made.

    http://www.amazon.com/Imperial-Pickelhaube-Officer-Helmet-Leather/dp/B004RYF5CS

    And of course, in chrome!

    http://www.amazon.com/Prussian-Pickelhabue-Spiked-Helmet-Shipping/dp/B00CUJTZMS/ref=pd_sim_sbs_sg_5

  46. Sieg Says:

    YYZ, ya definitely wouldn’t want to wwear an original, even if ya could. Head sizes were a hella smaller when Pickelhauben were the rage. All of the originals I’ve handled have been size pinhead.

    That said, here is a nice repop. Kinda plain, but well-made.

    http://www.amazon.com/Imperial-Pickelhaube-Officer-Helmet-Leather/dp/B004RYF5CS

    And of course, in chrome!

    http://www.amazon.com/Prussian-Pickelhabue-Spiked-Helmet-Shipping/dp/B00CUJTZMS/ref=pd_sim_sbs_sg_5

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  47. YYZ Skinhead Says:

    Sieg,

    Both of those two are awesome, but I gotta purchase one of the chrome ones. It would look kickass with my Red Baron-inspired dream bike.

    YYZ Skinhead

  48. Sieg Says:

    YYZ, if ya aren’t into this site yet, ya should be….

    http://www.hessenantique.com

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  49. JMacK Says:

    Well Sieg, I tried. Helmet was a great deal at 40 bucks. But when I got to the shipping choices there was only one choice and it was FedEx International and the price was 90 bucks to Canada plus duty and taxes!

    So I think I’ll have to hold off. Guess I need to make a trip down south or get some friends along the border…

    Respects
    JMacK

  50. stroker Says:

    Wasn’t gonna say anything on this topic, cuz I’ve said it all before in many different forums, but then it occurred to me that there are a lot of newer people reading and responding here, that may not have been around as long as I have, or seen the helmet battle as I have.
    So, in the interest of edumacating maybe the FEDS and any other alphabet agency lurking here, I believe I have some straight forward opinions that may be if not beneficial, at least entertaining.
    Also….I live in California, so much of what I say here is a result of that incarceration, but I’ve found most other state laws to be similar, or less restrictive.
    First: The argument that lives will be saved by wearing a helmet has never been proven. Do-Gooders that spout drivel of how many more lives were lost after helmet laws were repealed are twisting the stats, or ignoring the increase in registered riders.
    Second: Helmets may save your life in certain circumstances. In others it can, and has killed!
    Third: Helmets for cage drivers? Ain’t gonna happen Studies have been done, and even the motorcycle helmet advocates admit that wearing one in a car is dangerous. Why? BECAUSE YA CAN’T SEE OR HEAR! Getting those same nanny-state advocates to make the leap that “hey, maybe motorcyclists can’t see or hear either” is, of course not gonna get past their own blinders!
    Fourth: Insurance companies push the rhetoric that helmets save lives, and are always trying to get mc riders to pay more.
    Fifth: Next time you’re stopped for an “Illegal” helmet and receive a citation, plead not guilty. When you get to the court, ask the black-robed individual, and ask the cop (who may or may not show up) to please provide you with the list of approved helmets, because when you bought yours, it was represented to be approved. Guess what? There ain’t no list! Why? Because as soon as some state agency produces such a list, and then someone dies wearing an “approved” helmet, it’s lawsuit time. Nobody is ever gonna make that list. And that may help you in court. it has in my trials.

    Helmets are useful. I own several. I wear them in California because it’s the law. I rode here in Califas for over 25 years without one, before Dick-Head Floyd crammed one down on our heads with a snort of derision and victory! I’ve been in wrecks both with them, and without them. I think they are a double edged sword, that should be left to us, the rider, to decide when to wear.
    One of the leading causes of accidents, both car and mc, is fatigue.
    On a hot day, cooped up inside a full face, even with the window open, your body temperature will climb, and before you know it, you’re dehydrated and yes, fatigued! Many helmets are heavy. Even novelty ones can be heavy when worn all day, forcing yourself into the wind. The extra weight wears on you after hours in the saddle. Now you’re in danger of getting INTO an accident with your gubmint approved safety device being the culprit! I wear my full-face at night, when it’s cold, or when it’s raining. I wear a jockey style light weight helmet some may call a novelty helmet, most of the time.
    It has a small sun visor integral to it, and is double strapped. It barely passes as a DOT approved device. I don’t care. If I gotta wear one, this is the one I use. It don’t weight much.

    This fight will go on as long as the Safety Nazis are alive. They are gonna damn well take care of us by force, because even though our arguments make sense to any one who cares to listen objectively, they know better than us. We are all obviously deranged just because we wanna ride them “murder-sycles.”

    Keep fightin’ tho’ my brethren, don’t give up……join ABATE or MMA, or even your local COC. There ARE battles going on in every state. Become a freedom fighter.
    Don’t just sit back and bitch about it. (present company I’m sure, excepted)

    CTL

  51. Sieg Says:

    JMack, if ya want one, let me know. I will get it and ship it up to ya, or I can maybe send it to someone I know along your side of the border.

    Respects;

    Sieg

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  52. Meh Says:

    “If Republicans are supposed to be so anti-helmet law, why does every state in the deep south (Republican through and through) have a mandatory helmet law except South Carolina?”

    Because SC ABATE was active years ago and met with legislators. It also continues to support legislators who support adult freedom of choice. Friendly, positive interaction was and is key.

    A few votes can EASILY be decisive in many elections and there is actually zero downside at the ballot box when a legislator sides with bikers rights.

    BTW there is also zero downside to getting rid of POV inspections outside the Rust Belt as mechanical failures don’t contribute significantly to crash rates. SC dealers and shops were losing money doing inspections and raising rates wouldn’t fly, so they worked against inspections and the requirement was rescinded.

  53. Tactical111 Says:

    Have ridden bikes since 1967 mostly in So Cal on and off road but now in SE Michigan. Have crashed/slid down many times with and without a helmet on. Have been lucky but can truthfully say helmets have probably saved my life as evidenced by the damage to the helmet.

    I get the whole “personal freedom” and “Nanny State” arguements but personally never ride w/o a good helmet on even though it’s not a full face though I have one of those too. To me it just seems like the smart thing to do.

  54. 11c_infantry Says:

    @Glenn S,
    So are you saying the guys that work at barnyard are LEMC members? If so, that probably explains why they look at me funny when I come in wearing a real three piece patch set.
    L&R to those who earned it,
    11c
    SOTSFFSOTS

  55. Tooj Says:

    Rider weight limits…coming right up!

  56. YYZ Skinhead Says:

    Snow and Sieg,

    BIG PROPS for those kickass links. I never know what odd but desired info I’ll find on Rebel’s site.

    YYZ Helmethead

  57. Sieg Says:

    T111, I got my first sled in 1967, in el-Lay. I’ve ridden all over the country, based outta Kali, Chicago, and a few points in between.

    Never wore a helmet unless I was required to do so by law.

    Been down, really, seriously down, a handful of times, and have never so much as bumped my head. Went down on the PCH, out past Malibu, on my first hog, broke everything there was to break-guess I hit my head, but I was out for three days, so I didn’t notice! The other times I always managed to keep my gourd of the ground.

    If you want to wear a lid, hey-I absolutely support yer right to wear it, a thousand and ten percent. At the very least, it will keep a riders face pretty for the funeral.

    That said, ANY helmet law, or any other mandatory equipment law, sucks.

    FTF/FTP/FTG/FTW
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  58. Big RAGU Says:

    So much time & energy is spent by Cats
    Screaming “Who the fuck is you to tell me what to Do”

    Well I ride, and have both Full Face Helmets & 1/2 Dot & German Style as well.

    No matter the weather, still prefer my Full Face.

    That said, The reason why I wear any Helmet is for safety, My Safety.

    The problem is when riders actively choose not to

    Then go down, traumatic brain injuries occur & medical costs skyrocket &
    If their is insurance that’s adequate to begin with
    So we have to pick up the bill for your choices I had no say so in

    Health care companies & insurances love to
    “We have a responsibility to our share holders”
    Which is to make them money 1st- so fuck their funny, warm & fuzzy commercials
    Tell the truth, if profits sag & reduced, the companies lobby to change the law
    To require the riders to wear a Helmet so as to protect their
    Profits, not their beloved riders.

    That said, I care about ALL riders so yes, Please wear one all the time.

    It’s sad were a minor or moderate crash goes nuclear for poor chouces

  59. Snow Says:

    BIG RAGU
    Before anyone slams you here let me state something, this country was founded by people who wanted choices, choices in where they lived, jobs they held, religions they practiced or didn’t practice. It was NOT founded for insurance companies bottom line, politicians PAC money, or the latest feel good scam.
    We are the descendents of those men and women who put their lives on the line for that freedom. Our fathers and grandfathers fought wars and some gave their lives so we could remain free. Now you want to come here and tell us to submit because insurance companies aren’t making as many millions as they projected because they have to pay a claim.
    Well my answer to you is the same as to them, FUCK YOU, TOUGH SHIT or as my friend WARTHOG so eloquently puts it, GO FUCK YOURSELF, EAT SHIT AND DIE.
    Now understand this comes from someone who chooses to wear a full face helmet, those that pass on the helmet altogether probably feel more strongly about the subject.
    Support Your Local
    FTF ACAB
    Snow

  60. Sieg Says:

    “So much time & energy is spent by Cats Screaming “Who the fuck is you to tell me what to Do””

    Wouldn’t be wasted if the muffler-sniffers at NHTSA and the various insurance lobbies would quit foisting the agit-prop off on us as science.

    If you take the time to look at the numbers NHTSA posts, you’ll find that in most states, non-helmet wearing riders die at a much lower rate than those wearing helmets. As far as the insurance costs, that’s an old, old bugaboo. The vast majority of accidents involve motor vehicles other than bikes-you can, again, verify all this on NHTSA’s site. Given that only a tiny percentage of all injuries suffered in accidents are suffered by motorsickle riders, it doesn’t add up that they are driving up insurance rates. Even given the amount of money a TBI will eat-up, they aren’t driving up insurance rates.

    Most motorcycle accidents involve either a beginning rider, a rider who has recently moved up to a larger scoot, or alcohol. Especially alcohol.

    Mayhap given all of that, it would be better to require mandatory breathalyzers via an ignition interlock?! That’s sarcasm, before anyone jumps me.

    Bottom line. It’s not your business if I wear a helmet, an orange vest, chaps, or a doo-wa-diddy when I ride. You mind your bidness and I’ll mind mine.

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  61. stroker Says:

    @ BigRagu:
    You sound like you’ve drunk the cool-aid. You’re spouting the same drivel the safety-know-nothing-Nazis want us to believe. I agree with Sieg’s post above. The stats do NOT support your opinion. Your argument SOUNDS good, even sounds reasonable, to the uninformed. Still, I support your right to say what you want, and wear what you want. Just don’t try to force it on me.

  62. Tooj Says:

    So much time & energy is spent by Cats Screaming “I fucking want to tell you what to do”. The reasons why are immaterial and serve as hollow excuses.

    It’s like teaching a pig to tap dance…

  63. Phuquehed Says:

    Heh heh heh…Sieg beat me to the inevitable with RAGU’s post and does it much nicer and more eloquently than I can. You got lucky, RAGU, you fucker!

  64. Cap'n Bill Says:

    Well, I sent an email to the CDC and all I’ve got back so far was a computer generated reply.
    @ CN – I have BC/BS also & feel like if I pay then I ‘should’ be able to play, however ‘risky’ my activity is. I mean, I haven’t fallen down in a long time and usually avoid crowds of cars & such that would happily assist me in falling.

    Respects

    FTP FTW

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