A Conversation

October 23, 2009

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(This story was originally published on October 23 and corrected on October 24, 2009.  The corrections are explained in an endnote.)

The dark heart of the Mongols case has always been entrapment.

In several verifiable instances, one or more of the four, male, ATF (Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives) Agents who patched with the Mongols and the paid undercover informants who assisted the ATF blatantly tried to criminalize the club. And, sometimes Mongols patch holders were caught on electronic surveillance trying to stop this criminalization.

Entrapment is always a problem in cases involving undercover police officers and paid informants. Law professors call it “Conceptual Retributive Entrapment.” Cops call it “making sure the bad guys get what is coming to them.” Whatever you call it, it has become a feature of what at least one legal scholar calls “The Sadistic State.” The way entrapment was used in the Mongols case was worse than that.

In the Mongols case, federal police officers working undercover and paid informants sometimes became actual agents provocateur. Agent provocateur is now almost an antique phrase. Joseph Conrad wrote about one of these spies in his novel The Secret Agent. The French term, agent provocateur, describes a policeman who radicalizes or criminalizes an unpopular group in order to give the government an excuse for punishing that group. The use of agents provocateur is one of the distinguishing characteristics of totalitarianism.

Reasonable men may argue about whether former ATF Agent William Queen acted as an agent provocateur during a previous investigation of the Mongols Motorcycle Club called Operation Ivan. It appears that former ATF Agent Jay Dobyns became an agent provocateur during an investigation of the Hells Angels Motorcycle club called Operation Black Biscuit. Dobyns contrived a murder and tried to make members of his club accessories.

Motorcycle clubs have obvious weaknesses. Motorcycle club members often participate in the underground economy and break many traffic laws. And the same men are loyal to a fault so that loyalty can be exploited. And, another weakness among these men is their unabashed endorsement of traditional masculine virtues.

Official Policy

In its undercover investigations of motorcycle clubs the ATF seems to have been seeking to find the line between what is and is not criminal provocation.

The official policy on entrapment by undercover agents is unambiguously defined. Federal rules have been written and “are imposed to ensure the government does not offer inducements to crime to persons who are not predisposed to do so.”

These inducements are common in bad policing and include, for example: Offering a drug addict drugs for participating in a drug deal; pressuring a small time drug dealer into a large drug deal in order to enhance the consequences of his crime; proposing a crime to a friend on the telephone or in a text message or in an email message and insisting on a reply to create the federal crime of “Using a Communications or Telephonic Device;” and offering a desperately poor or unemployed man a large sum of money to break the law. .

In a memo dated May 30, 2002, then Attorney General John Ashcroft defined a set of procedures that would ensure against entrapment by under cover federal police. According to the procedures set forth in that memo, most of the actions taken by Undercover ATF Agents in Operation Black Rain would have had to have been regularly reviewed and approved by ATF Case Agent John Ciccone in consultation with then United States Attorney Thomas P. O’Brien. Had this been an FBI (Federal Bureau of Investigation) operation, rather than an ATF investigation, Ciccone and O’Brien would have also been obliged to “consult with the Chairman of the (FBI Headquarters) Criminal Undercover Operations Review Committee…whenever a serious legal, ethical, prosecutive or departmental policy question” arose.

But, the fact is that even though they are both federal police agencies and conduct the same sorts of investigations, the ATF and the FBI are allowed to play by different rules.

For example, “Hollywood” may have been a much less effective cop if he had worked for the FBI.


Kaos was a Mongols patch holder and an agent provocateur.

The story Kaos told the club was that he was a gangster from Wisconsin by way of Chicago. He implied that he was or had been connected to “The Chicago Syndicate,” or as it is sometimes described, “The Chicago Outfit.” The Chicago Syndicate was founded by Al Capone. In 1960, Syndicate boss Sam Giancana fixed the Cook County presidential election to ensure the victory of John F. Kennedy.

Kaos portrayed himself as a tough guy and a cinematic rogue and the motorcycle outlaws to whom he worked to ingratiate himself were seduced.

In a tape recorded conversation Kaos brags, “See. you know what? I used to have shit like that, actually, when I had my own crew. And uh, we weren’t even like, we were…” (Kaos seems to have stammered when he lied. The deeper the lie, the more difficulty he would have getting the lie out of his mouth.) We didn’t have a name, nothing. We were just fucking selling dope. You know? Fucking dope organization.”

The gullible Mongol to whom he was telling this just agreed, “Yeah.” Psychologist call this sort of agreement, token agreement for the sake of being polite, “acquiescence.” Acquiescence is always different from agreement in reality but not always so different legally.

“I call a mother fucker up,” Kaos continued. “Be like, grab a shovel! I’m picking you up in a half hour. I pull up in the dude’s driveway and he’s blocking it with a shovel. And, then he’s mad because I didn’t have a dude in the trunk to bury.”

The nutty and colorful ex-gangster is a cinematic convention. Bruce Willis played a slightly more subtle version of this character in The Whole Nine Yards. And, this conversation was recorded in Las Vegas, where even the Mayor has been rumored to have once been mobbed up.

Over time, Kaos became less colorful and amusing and more annoying.  Kaos eventually left the Las Vegas chapter to “visit his sick mother in Chicago.” When he returned he transferred his membership to the Henderson, Nevada Chapter of the Mongols. While a member of that chapter, Kaos introduced a man named “J. Hollywood” to the club. Hollywood was also an agent provocateur.

The 33 Kilo Coke Deal

When the Mongols case jumped into the headlines a year ago, one of most spectacular accusations in the indictment was that:

“On September 18, 2007, in San Bernardino, California, defendants R. Lozano, H. Reynolds and I. Padilla and an unindicted co-conspirator armed themselves with firearms and arranged to purchase 33 kilograms of cocaine with an undercover law enforcement officer and a confidential government informant.”

This page has been looking at this blatantly mendacious transaction for about four months. It clearly seems to have been what federal law calls “subjective entrapment.” The substance that was transacted might have weighed 33 kilos or not. It might have been cocaine but probably was not. And, the transaction comprised an ATF Undercover Agent buying whatever the substance was from another government employee while three Mongols and another man (the unindicted co-conspirator who never had anything to do with the motorcycle club) watched.

For the four men who were not police officers, the 33 kilo coke deal was something between easy money and a favor for a friend. But a year after the fact it became a headline.

And, it was probably not the worst of the undercovers’ theatrics. This page has been led to believe by well informed sources that these agents committed multiple felonies during the investigation including at least one serious felony. The ATF Undercover Agent who staged the bogus coke deal was a patched Mongol known to the Club as “Hollywood.” The same ATF agent provocateur, “Hollywood,” attempted to entrap other members of the Mongols Motorcycle Club in another city, months later, in a similar “major drug deal.”

Kaos, who introduced Hollywood to the Club, served as Sergeant at Arms for the Las Vegas chapter of the Mongols. While a member of the Vegas chapter, Kaos tried to corrupt another participant in the 33 kilo cocaine deal — former Vegas chapter President Harry Reynolds.

Special Agent John “Hollywood” Case

Only one of the ATF Undercover Agents who worked the Mongols case has ever been officially identified. That man is Darrin Kozlowski. Without official confirmation, this page has concluded that the ATF Agent who played the role of Hollywood is a man named John Carr.  Carr is the ATF Agent who, on Kaos’ recommendation, was allowed to patch into the Henderson, Nevada chapter of the Mongols without prospecting.

In his memoir titled Under and Alone former ATF Agent William Queen says:

“John Ciccone, in his years targeting the growing OMG” (by which he means Outlaw Motorcycle Gang) “problem in Southern California, had developed a ‘gang’ of his own; ATF Special Agents John Carr, Eric Harden and Darren Kozlowski, fondly referred to as Koz, were the core. They’d all started with the bureau together and, after a decade, remained the hard chargers they’d been at the beginning of their careers.”

Queen acknowledges Carr at the end of his book, with the words, “Thanks to John Ciccone, Darrin Kozlowski, John Carr, Eric Harden, Cleetus and Paul.”

Carr was awarded the Federal Bar Association’s Medal of Valor Award in Los Angeles in 2002. And his commendation, read into the Congressional Record, seems to describe his modus operandi. “Special Agent Carr earned his award for working undercover to catch violent gang members…. Carr transformed his look, acquainted himself with the criminals, and pretended to help them in their operation. Carr gave the criminals false information, which led them to traps planned by the ATF.”

The steps that Kaos and Hollywood, who this page believes to be Carr, took to lead the Mongols into full blown criminality seem to exemplify what grifters call a “long con.”

Before introducing ATF Agent John Carr to the club, Kaos recorded a one hour and 20 minute conversation with Harry Reynolds in September 2006  The conversation took place a full year before the bogus cocaine deal. And, in that conversation Kaos is obviously trying to entice his fellow Mongols into criminality. And, Harry Reynolds keeps trying to straighten out his fellow club officer.

The snatches of conversation that follow are excerpted from that official recording.

Criminalizing A Prospect

Reynolds ordered the talk with his Sergeant At Arms because Kaos was compelling a prospect to participate in criminal activity.

Kaos: What’d I do bro?

Reynolds: (Inaudible) um….

Kaos: That thing with Milo?

Reynolds: Yeah, you hurt my feelings, you both. You…you were treated shitty as a prospect, and he, last week he asked me if this club…if he would ever be asked to do anything illegal. And, I told him no, dude. The club would never make you do anything And then what happens? You take him to do something illegal….

Here Have Some Criminal Proceeds

Reynolds also had to tell Kaos to stop trying to give him proceeds from Kaos’ imagined crimes.

Reynolds: You don’t make money off of them, what you do, you turn around and hand it back to them….

Kaos: Yep, yep, yep.

Reynolds: . . .okay. What did you do that day you came here with an envelope for me? You hand me an envelope?

Kaos: Oh?

Reynolds: What’d I do? It ain’t mine.

Kaos: Yeah.

Reynolds: I don’t make money off you.

Kaos: Yeah.

Reynolds: You know. If we do something together fine. I…I think that’s wrong. That hurts. That really fucking hurts. Because I think brotherhood and helping each other is first. Not to mention…okay…I might be taking it a little personal, maybe I’m not, I don’t know, but uh…I need a bike. Milo needs a bike. Your bike ain’t tuned too good…

Kaos: Yeah.

Reynolds: …why is he so, you know what I mean? Hello!

Kaos: Yeah.

Reynolds: That… I don’t understand that. You know. Nothing can…here first. You’re thinking me, me, me. That’s all you think about! Me, me, me.

Kaos: Yeah.

Crime In The Name Of The Club

Reynolds then told Kaos that if he insisted on doing something illegal he should at least take his Mongols tee shirt off before he did it so as not to implicate the club in his crimes.

Reynolds: You know what? Mongol no! Mongol no. Not to mention…and this is the other thing I’m bothered with you about…you went to do something that was illegal with your shirt on! You were wearing a support shirt. That makes it a Mongol issue. I’m just pointing it out. I won’t tell them that. But, I’m telling you that. I’m not doing nothing about it. I’m telling you….

Kaos: Alright.

Reynolds: So you can think next time. I don’t want to see that shit like that again. Because I…think about it.

Kaos: Yeah.

Reynolds: (inaudible.) You got a shirt, they ever pull you over…whatever…and they find out? Bam! Okay? They can run your name (inaudible). Oh, you were (inaudible) Mongols. (You say) I don’t know what you, you are talking about. (Cop says) Well you’re wearing that. I know you got that. Now…you fucking…. Now all the house is gonna be ready cause… now you put all of us, and not just you…. Him too! Because you know what? He seen you wearing the shirt! He’s fucking three year fucking
Member. Should be telling you. You shouldn’t be wearing that! What we’re doing, ‘cause I don’t check (inaudible.) When I seen you out here I knew where you were going.

Kaos: Yeah.

Reynolds: So I can’t say nothing about your shirt, right?

Kaos: Yeah, yeah.

Reynolds: But he did. But he let you. He let you wear his shirt. Now my house is gonna get raided, because of his fucking deal? I don’t fucking think so.

Mongols And Money

Reynolds tries to make excuses for Kaos. The problem, as Reynolds sees it, is that Kaos’ sponsor did not properly school him when he prospected. So, Reynolds tries to tell Kaos what is important and what is not important about belonging to a motorcycle club.

Kaos: Yeah, basically that was my worry. Because I need the money you know?

Reynolds: And I understand that, but you know what Kaos? And, I don’t mean to be disrespectful. Brotherhood is first. Money second.

Kaos: Yeah.

Reynolds: I could give a fuck about money. Because you know what? When I’m in…laying in the gutter…my brother’s gonna be there. Not, you know…. Money ain’t gonna float up to me.

Kaos: Yeah.

Reynolds: You know what I mean? And I’m not saying you’re like….

Kaos: But I still gotta pay my bills, bro. You know?

Reynolds: I understand that. But you’d rather (inaudible) with a prospect who was a cool dude and (inaudible)…. I understand bills need to be paid. You know what? I don’t work. She don’t work. But you don’t see me going out there fucking over my brothers, just to make a couple bucks…. Like I said…I…I’m disappointed in you but I don’t blame you because you don’t know your grounds as much. But I’m telling you right now, your grounds are, are a lot, and it’s not me…. I understand you’re worried about losing a deal but you know what? Fuck that deal. Fuck that fucking deal. This is more important, I think. And if you don’t think it’s more important then I can’t teach (inaudible). You know what I mean? This club’s first.

Kaos: Yeah.

Reynolds: This club is fucking first. I don’t care if I could make a million dollars. If it had anything to do…and I swear to God I mean that…and if it had anything to do with putting my brothers in jeopardy or anything like that I wouldn’t do it. I would not do it. Cause, I (don’t) give a fuck about money. I give a fuck about this club. We’re brothers.

Eventually, Harry Franklin “Face’ Reynolds’ house was raided. He is defendant 51 in the Mongols case. Franklin was indicted by the February 2008 Grand Jury on multiple counts including racketeering. He is one of two defendants currently seeking to sever his case from the racketeering charge the government has used to prosecute other defendants in the case.

This story was originally posted on October 23, 2009 and corrected on October 24, 2009. The original version of this story stated that ATF Special Agent John Case assumed the road name, and was known to the Mongols, as “Kaos.”   That detail was incorrect.  Case was known to the Mongols as “J. Hollywood.” Kaos was a paid informant who introduced Special Agent Case (Hollywood) to the Henderson Chapter of the Mongols Motorcycle Club. Case was eventually allowed to patch into the chapter without prospecting. Case (Hollywood) was the author of the bogus 33 kilo cocaine deal in San Berdoo.  Case also tried to contrive at least one other “major drug deal.”  Throughout the investigation, Mongols patch holders were suspicious of both Kaos and “Hollywood” as Mongols had earlier been suspicious of ATF Agent Darrin Koslowski.  Shortly before the arrests last October, “Hollywood” was expelled from the club.

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122 Responses to “A Conversation”

  1. EL Jefe Says:

    Saw this on another site:

    When the Nazis came for the communists, I remained silent; I was not a communist.

    When they locked up the social democrats, I remained silent; I was not a social democrat.

    When they came for the trade unionists, I did not speak out; I was not a trade unionist.

    When they came for the Jews, I did not speak out; I was not a Jew.

    When they came for me, there was no one left to speak out.

    Martin Niemöller

  2. Roach Says:

    Wow, that was the first time I have ever heard from a cop that I didnt want to punch in the face. Although I still hate and have no respect for cops, I have respect for you. Thanks for writing.

  3. Goldsboro Williams Says:

    Thank you gentlemen.

    With Rebel’s kind permission, I will always be available for an alternative viewpoint.


  4. Rebel Says:

    Dear Goldsboro Williams,

    That was a nice post and I appreciate it.

    Long ago, when I was a rootless kid, I used to lift weights with a BIG ugly, small town cop and he taught me to ride a motorcycle. Before the concepts of “officer as stranger” and “professional policing” came along, this really was a politer, fairer, better world.

    In a million years, I can’t imagine that guy ever pretending to be something he was not just so he could arrest people.

    Come back soon,


  5. Dante Says:

    It is human nature to put things in neat little groups and then produce broad generalizations about them. There was a time in our history where if you weren’t part of a group, you were dead and any other group than your own was the enemy, regardless of whether they were equally decent human beings or not.

    Generalizations are just that – general; and never truly indicative of the facts. Most people don’t care to let these facts get in the way of their way of thinking.

    Welcome GW. I think it will be interesting to get your take on a lot of these events, and your ability to be honest compared to most other LEO’s is refreshing.

  6. Magnet Says:

    What’s on the outside doesn’t necessarily reflect what’s on the inside. Hang a badge, a suit, a priest’s collar, a patch, or whatever on a piece of shit excuse for a man and he’s still a piece of shit. Hang them on a good man and he’s still a good man. It’s who you are that counts, not what you do. In my opinion, anyway.

    Goldsboro Williams – good post.

    sled tramp – nice reply. Belated congrats on your new grandson – superb name!

  7. sled tramp Says:

    Goldsboro Williams:
    Thanks, that was very cool.In forty years of dealing with your peers, that’s the only thing I’ve ever agreed with.I greatly appreciate your time to write.
    sled tramp

  8. Goldsboro Williams Says:

    I really enjoyed this thread, and I wanted to put in my two cents. But before I do, let me start with a disclaimer: I’m a cop… Yes, I know that everything I now have to say is suspect, but that’s ok. I just wanted to tell you guys that not all cops are pieces of crap. Only about 80% are…

    So what would a cop find so compelling about this page? The concept of true brotherhood.

    When I was a kid I was a bit of a hang-around at a club in Anchorage, AK. My experience hanging around simply taught me that the guys in the club were normal guys, only they had a fierce loyalty to each other. They were more concerned with hanging out with their friends and riding bikes then they were about putting on pretenses or moving up the corporate ladder. Any warm day was an excuse to fire up a homemade hibachi, and to drink a couple of cold beers. Everyone had fun, and if anyone got in a fight with an outsider at the Wild Cherry it was usually because the person was an asshole. The young guys were prone to stupidity (as all young guys are), and the old guys were prone to smirk and watch as the young guys did stunts that got themselves hurt. Everyone chased skirts, and life was good. Simple as that. Did people break the law? Sure. But that was an individual choice, and had nothing to do with the club. If someone broke the law and trouble started could they count on a brother to help them out? Sure, but that was again an individual choice, based on individual beliefs. I saw some guys that would help anyone out, and some guys that were real careful about what they did. Those were usually older guys with families to support. The club was simply the common denominator, and there was no criminal conspiracy. That stuff is the bullshit that undercovers use to justify their lifestyle, and to keep them riding bikes on the government dime and out from behind a desk doing paperwork.

    Anyways, I got popped by the police a couple of times myself (no, I wasn’t set up, I was guilty as hell), and soon found myself talking to the recruiter in the courtroom, rather than face time as a young skinny kid in the pen. In the service, I again fell in with a group of guys that could be described as unconventional, but who I would have trusted my life and property to. So far, so good.

    Afterward, I became a cop (almost by accident) and again I expected to find a brotherhood. Boy, was I wrong. Even the closest friends I had in the beginning are no longer my friends, and after I had been on about 10 years my police friends could be counted on one hand. This, mind you, in a department of about 2000. I don’t know what it is, but the ego’s and the attitudes are unbearable. Not to mention the fact that they have NO idea what friendship and brotherhood mean. In addition the cops here have NO sense that they are supposed to be public servants. They really don’t get it that they are supposed to work for the people, and not serve as feudal lords over the people.

    And undercover officers? Well, I just don’t get them. I understand working in plain clothes to catch a crook in the act, to stop a mugger, or to catch a burglar that is breaking into people’s homes. I cannot, however, fathom the concept of pretending to be a biker, just to fuck over the people that you have become “friends” with. To me this is just an extension of who they are as people, i.e., they are not people who are worthy of having friends. I have met several of these types, and to me they are all narcissistic soul-less Judases. They live a pretend life that they do not have the guts to live for real.

    I have over 20 years on now as a cop, and I have not lied once to put someone in jail. I don’t measure my pecker by ruining people’s lives, nor do I bend the rules to cite anyone. If I have broken a rule or two, it is because I have understood the circumstances that led to an incident, and as a result have let too many people go with a warning. I really believe that 9 times out of 10, a warning is all that people need to stop them from doing something that could screw their lives up. Then again, I truly believe that at heart most people are decent, so maybe that makes me screwed up too.

    Anyways, sorry for the long rambling note, but I just wanted you guys to know that some of the cops out there are not hung up on screwing people over. My job (for the year and a half I have left) as I see it, is to simply be there for people who need help. Those guys that are my friends that are cops see the world the same way. Unfortunately, we tend to get painted with the same wide brush that club members do.

    So that is the long and the short of it. Not all cops are bad, and some of us do understand the concepts of friendship and brotherhood. Just not a lot of us.

    Well, if any of you are passing through **** and see an short ugly old bald guy riding a Harley feel free to flag me down. I’d be happy to buy you a brew and apologize on behalf of my self-absorbed back stabbing coworkers.

    PS By the way, after reading that guy’s posts, I think he is a cop too.
    PSS Every investigation is based on money. If clubs simply made everyone not personally known prospect for two years, no undercover would come into a club. Then all you would have to worry about is snitches who are willing to set you up in exchange for working off a charge, and hopefully you get a feel for those long before the prospect phase.


    Mongols are back will start flying colors this weekend !!!!!!!!!!!!!! fuk the feds

  10. c8652 Says:

    Hey Rebel, just going with the laugh here. Your quote to WD on Fayettenam Hoes’ posts helped drop the nickle in my brain housing group.. “I really found your free verse or whatever the fuck it is you get drunk and write very amusing today.” That is some funny shit. To me at least. I never understood the character Morris in Sling Blade until just this moment. It’s free verse.

    Vaughan Cunningham: I don’t understand.
    Morris: Exactly the point, my young level-headed friend.
    Vaughan Cunningham: I don’t get it.
    Morris: Well, I rest my case.

    Morris: Dots look good on paper. You don’t sing them anyway, you’re just showing your true Aries color now.
    Doyle: Stay out of my goddam face, you fucking buzzard!

    Terence: I don’t think that’s right. I believe the “Dot Dot Dot” come between “Medula” and “Oblongota”.
    [Morris shakes his head]
    Terence: Well, it did!
    Morris: The dots are where I say they are. Melody and tune, that’s your trade, Terence. You’re a tunesmith.

    Keep sending your posts Fayettenam Hoe. No one does it better.




  12. Rebel Says:

    Dear Steve,

    I cannot speak for the Mongols and I haven’t checked the Rivera case for about a week.

    Yesterday, when I looked at Cavazos et al., Judge Cooper had not yet modified her restraining order from last year. Last week when I looked at Rivera, I saw that she had still not modified Rivera. The ACLU had asked her to do that in mid-October. I will look again late today. When I know you will know.

    And the Mongols Motorcycle Club will fly the patch when they want why they want. Next week would not surprise me. There is a fairly important hearing Monday at 1:30 in the Roybal.

    your pal,




  14. fayettenam hoe Says:

    guilty, i am, for thinkng about a brutal part , trying to be a citezen, it was the Law makers that turned me inside out, and they call those masses Law abiding, the true criminals are the law makers, the worst hypocrates of all; lie’rs and theives, wellcome to the world of rat pak H.D. a world of lozers, bound thru an antiquated mentality, of fuck you too, we do survive

  15. Gringo1%er Says:

    thanks James ..

  16. JAMES Says:

    Anyone who may have been keeping up with the BLOGS by,OUTLAWS M.C. member, KEVIN ( SPIKE1%er ) O’NEILL, he has moved to another spot, http://www.fedsgonebad.blogspot.com/

  17. Philo Says:

    @ Doc Jones,
    Bro, that’s nothing. Now they’re running guns for Hamas, the Palestinian terrorist organization. LOL How progressive.

  18. Doc Jones Says:

    I just saw a dude riding down the road flyimg a Sons of Anarchy patch. What the fuck is happening? I watched a couple of spisodes on the internet (hulu.com). When the members were in jail they went to the blacks to pay for protection from the whites and the mexicans. They would never make it in the pen acting like that. I know it’s only a show but it’s really a bunch of crap. Wearing a cut from a make believe totally weak piece of shit club? Come on man!!

  19. Not Surprised Says:

    Rebel: Let me see……..the New York Times is stealing your stuff,

    an MC in AZ wants to kill you, other people plaigerizing your words—

    Yep. I’d say you’re definitely on the right track here Rebel.

    I’d like fax you a beer or something if I could…

  20. Philo Says:

    Happy Halloween Bitches!

  21. Gusto Says:


    Happy Halloween brother!!! like Gringo1%er said drink some cervezas, it’ll make you feel better. some punks you cant reach but hopefully he got the message…Cant wait to read all those other stories you got coming up..

  22. sled tramp Says:

    Had I known of your day,I wouldn’t have sent the “humorous” site pic I found.Respect to your patience.
    White Devil,
    Back home we have a saying,”People don’t understand being reasoned with…people understand being cut”.
    You’vr been cut off by most people here.
    I have no idea why you’re here.Go away.
    I’ll save you the trouble…”Fuck you Sled Tramp”..
    Now…..see what a nice guy I am?

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