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Doc Cavazos Flipped

Sat, Jul 4, 2009

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Doc Cavazos Flipped

Right this minute, open a beer or pour a shot. Walk outside and spill some on the ground. Love them or hate them, the Mongols Motorcycle Club will be missed.

Ruben “Doc” Cavazos flipped on January 23rd. He seems to have gone quickly and easily. He was the very first Mongol to plead guilty to count one of the indictment. He confessed that he led a murdering, drug dealing criminal conspiracy called the Mongols Motorcycle Club. He also confessed “that the Mongols Registered Trademarks afforded a source of influence over the RICO enterprise that defendant admits he established, operated, controlled, conducted and participated in the conduct of….”

“As part of his guilty plea (Cavazos) agreed to the forfeiture of all right, title and
interest in certain assets acquired or maintained by him as a result of his violation of (the RICO statute) including…the ‘Mongols Registered Trademarks’ or ‘marks’” and admitted that the marks were subject to forfeiture to the United States.

The government has also cited the guilty pleas to Count One of the Indictment by numerous defendants besides Cavazos as proof that the Mongols Motorcycle Club is a criminal conspiracy and the name and patch are subject to forfeiture. The government has argued that the pleas demonstrate “a nexus between the violation of which the defendant has been convicted (or to which he has pled) and the property sought.”

Next The Newspaper Ads

Very soon, perhaps as early as Monday, July 6th, Judge Florence-Marie Cooper will authorize the enforcement of that seizure. Last weekend at a Mongols party, sources have told this page, ATF Agents seized a box of Mongols shirts. Those agents were either jumping the gun or they were practicing.

The day before that party, Assistant United States Attorney Steven R. Welk, Head of the Asset Forfeiture Section, had Cavazos’ attorney, Angel Navarro show Cavazos the final draft of a “Memorandum of Points and Authorities” and the government’s “proposed Preliminary Order of Forfeiture of Registered Trademarks.” Cavazos agreed to allow the forfeiture to begin now.

Technically, the forfeiture of the club trademarks are part of Cavazos’ sentence so the government needed his permission to start that part of his punishment now, before he is formally sentenced.

As soon as Judge Cooper approves the proposed order, the Department of Justice will begin running legal advertisements in newspapers announcing the forfeiture. The forfeiture will become irrevocable and final when Cavazos is formally sentenced. He is now scheduled to be sentenced on February 22nd, 2010.

Who Were The Mongols

The Mongols Motorcycle Club was founded in Los Angeles in 1969. The patch the Mongols wore throughout most of their existence was designed in 1970. Like most clubs during that era, the Mongols were greatly influenced by highly disciplined, profoundly alienated, Vietnam Veterans who had been infected with violence, calloused against mere materialism and greeted upon their return with contempt and scorn.

The Mongols were a relatively unknown club with fewer than 100 members until a dispute over their bottom rocker erupted in 1977. In their early days, the Mongols wore their current three piece patch with a bottom rocker that stated, for example, Long Beach or Southbay. In the mid 1970s some members of the club began wearing a bottom rocker that said California.

When the preeminent club in California, the Hells Angels Motorcycle Club, objected, the Mongols sewed on a tiny, second bottom rocker above the California rocker. The tiny rocker said Southern.

Some Angels allegedly took that as an insult and much unpleasantness ensued for decades. Men died for the Mongols patch. Men in more than one club died over the issue of the Mongols patch.

Doc Cavazos

The Mongols current troubles seem to spring from the day Doc Cavazos joined the club.

By his own account, Cavazos joined the Mongols without prospecting. In his first year, he has said, he recruited 200 new members who were more loyal to him than to the established hierarchy of the Mongols.

In the first seconds of a well known battle between members of the Mongols and members of the Hells Angels in Laughlin, Nevada in 2002, Mongols President Roger Pinney, a Vietnam veteran, was stabbed four times. While Pinney recovered and tended to the charge the government filed against him, Cavazos, the club’s Mother Chapter Sergeant at Arms, assumed control.

Cavazos may have reached his zenith on May 30, 2008. That evening Cavazos, his son, Lil’ Rubes, and three other Mongols attended the “Book Expo Celebrity Dinner” at a highly regarded place called Restaurant 208 in Beverly Hills. The Mongols were the honored guests of celebrity agent Alan Nevins.

Three months later, Cavazos was voted out of the Mongols in bad standing. Six weeks after that, the Department of Justice unleashed an army of militarized police to arrest Mongols in six states. Three months after that, seven months after his celebrity dinner, he gave up his club.

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239 Comments For This Post

  1. Joseph S Says:

    WOW!!!!!! What next for Doc??? The HA’s must love him. He is the best thing ever to happen to the Angels and the worst thing to happen to the Mongols.

    Joseph

  2. Doc Jones Says:

    Well, tough guy Cavazos ended up being a rat!! I wonder what is happening with his family and his old lady? This punk didn’t just give up the Mongols, he has made it difficult for all outlaw clubs. He’s a disgusting egomaniac.

  3. JAMES Says:

    DOES NOT SURPRISE ME AT ALL,ANYONE WHO KNEW ANYTHING ABOUT THIS GUY SHOULD HAVE KNOWN WHAT HE WAS ABOUT, BUT I DON’T THINK I WOULD BE TOO QUICK TO JUMP UP AND DOWN WITH JOY, AT LEAST NOT JUST YET.

  4. DirtyBruin Says:

    JosephS: If anyone’s pleased, it’s a mixed emotion. While I’m sure there are some who aren’t sorry to see the Mongols in dire straits – the fact is that the Powers That Be now have another hammer with which to pound on M/C’s – the threat of confiscating their club logo. I’ve commented on this site before – I hope all other clubs that might come to the attention of the Feds – and even those who think they won’t – take this as a sober warning to make sure that their club identity is as thoroughly protected from this kind of thing as possible.

    I almost hope the ATF does something so horrifying and shocking with their new property that it spurs any club that’s been thinking “this can’t happen” into protecting themselves.

    And then there’s the precedent being set of a 1% motorcycle club being legally branded as a criminal conspiracy. That’s not good for any other club the Feds see as being at all similar.

    I have no idea how this might trickle down to non-affiliated bikers, but I don’t think its a good sign generally. So I’m with Rebel – however one feels/felt about the Mongols M/C, this is sad and upsetting news.

  5. Joseph S Says:

    Dirty Bruin: Good Point.

  6. Squirts Says:

    I’m a newbie to the site, but wanted to kick in and say that I think DirtyBruin’s words carry a lot of weight… Not only does this activity by our Federal government threaten 1%er clubs, but clubs in general, and it’s not too much of a stretch to say that (non MC) clubs/ organizations/ associations/ militias in the US could be next. When you get out the crystal ball and peer into our (possible) future, I am reminded of Orwell’s “1984″… It’s a little late, but it’s definitely in the future, IMO. Respects to Aging Rebel and all reading my words.

  7. FTF Says:

    WOW! That’s about one of the biggest expected surprises to happen yet. Everyone expected it, everyone knew deep down it happened, but reading it like this still leaves a tinge of disgust in ones mouth.

  8. JUST A BIKER Says:

    WELL WE ALL CAN KISS THE CONSITUTION GOOD BYE CAUSE I DON’T CARE WHO YOU ARE NO ONE SHOULD BE HAPPY KNOWING THAT THE FEDS HAVE THE POWER TO TAKE AWAY OUR LIBERTIES..

    SO WHAT NEXT THE NFL HOW MANY FOOTBALL PLAYERS HAVE BEEN ARRESTED AND CONVICTED..

    HELL HOW ABOUT TAKING AWAY THE BADGE HOW MANY COPS HAVE BEEN CONVICTED OF CRIMES..

    IT IS FUNNY WHEN I WAS IN THE MILITARY WHAT WAS ACCEPTED AND WHAT I GOT AWAY WITH UNDER THE UMBRELLA OF DEFENDING MY COUNTRY..

    HOW MANY COPS ARE STILL OUT THERE THAT ARE DIRTY AND NO MATTER HOW MANY THERE MAY BE THE INSITUTION OF THE BADGE WILL NEVER BE TAKEN AWAY..

    WHAT THE KKK,NAZI’S,AND ALL THE HATE MAIL AND PROPAGANDER THEY GET TO PUT OUT THERE AND THEIR IDENTITY IS NOT SEIZED..

    THIS IS TRUELY A SAD DAY IN THIS COUNTRY..SO ANYONE WHO IS CHEERING OR JUMPING UP AND DOWN THAT THE MONGOLS ARE GONE AS IT HAS BEEN STATED..BETTER PREPARE FOR WE ARE NOW NOT THAT FAR AWAY FROM A STANDING IN A LINE WAITING FOR CHEESE AND BEING TOLD WHAT WE CAN WATCH ON TV AND WHAT BOOKS WE CAN READ..

    I SPEAK ONLY FOR MY SELF THIS IS NOT WHAT I WENT OFF TO WAR TO FIGHT FOR

    HELL THE GOVERMENT ALREADY OWNS GM AND A COUPLE OF BANKS WHAT IS NEXT CHIP IMPLANTS TO TRACK EVERYONE..

  9. DON COFFIN Says:

    WELL I WONDER WHAT FACE WILL YOU TELL YOU EX BROTHERS TO WEAR NOW. I THINK YOU SHOULD WEAR A CHEESE EATING RAT FACE.
    DON

  10. Joseph S Says:

    Hey Rebel, I am guessing any proceeds from his book are also going to the government. Am I right??

  11. Rebel Says:

    Dear Joseph S,

    In general, you are not allowed to profit from your crime by writing a book about it. In particular, there are lots of exceptions to this general rule. Doc published his book before he admitted to any crime. He was paid an advance against royalties. I don’t know the details of the deal.

    The advance is Doc’s to keep. Apparently he spent it all or gave it all away. He is now officially indigent and being represented by a Federal Defender. His publisher, Crown, and his agent, Nevins, are still entitled to their piece. The book is still in print. Now in paperback! I do not know if it has yet earned back its advance.

    I am a cynic and I know a little about how publishing works so I expect another book from Doc after he pays his debt to society. Sammy the Bull did it. So why not Doc?

    To get Doc’s future book money the government would have to go to the trouble of getting a list of Doc’s “victims.” Those victims could then be compensated out of Doc’s pocket but I do not see that happening.

    In short, no, Doc isn’t making any money now because he already made the money and spent it. Yeah, people in suits are still making money from Doc’s book. No, with the right representation, there is nothing to prevent Doc from writing a book about how the Mongols tried to get rid of him but instead he got rid of them. Look for the pre-sales on that one to start on Amazon in, oh, say, July of 2014.

    Your pal,
    Rebel

  12. BreakingPoint Says:

    Damn, 2014, thats really not that long at all…..

  13. JAMES Says:

    Has the thouhgt ever occured to anyone on this or any site, DOC may have been A FEDERAL PLANT, or PAID INFORMNANT, planted within the CLUB to help to destry it?The CIA does things in other countries, so why is this not a possibility, He may be really good friends of BILLY QUEEN, JAY DOBYNS, ETC.He admitted to not PROSPECTING in, He handed out PARTCHES to further his foothold and get people to want to follow him, he gave out according to him orders for others to do the dirty work under his supervision, so he claims it is all HE SAYS IT IS, but in all reality it is simply A MOTORCYCLE CLUB NOT UNLIKE ANY OTHER CLUBS OR ORGS.Think about it? I have a feeling he is not the only FED PLANTS in the MONGOLS,or in any otherCLUBS, so be very careful if it isn’t already too late for all CLUBS, ORGS. ETC.

  14. Joseph S Says:

    Maybe Docs’ purpose on this earth was to serve as a warning to others, on what NOT to do in life. This includes what not to do as a father,brother, and national president of a 1%er motorcycle club.

    Doc had a good job as a Radiology Tech at USC medical center, from my understanding they make some good coin and have good benefits. It also appears he had the respect and admiration of his only son and his brother. Not to mention his status as a Mongol.

    Boy,did he screw all that up in a big way!!!! His greed and lust for power led him,his son,his brother,and many others into a very bad situation in wich many will never recover.

    All he has left is Lil Rubes, and Al the suit. And something is telling me they are not to happy with him right now.

  15. Rebel Says:

    Dear James,

    Oh man! You just made my day. At last, somebody who is even more paranoid than I. I really needed that. I just got back from a really shitty trip to the Roybal Federal Building and I needed a laugh.

    No, Doc Cavazos was not a plant. No, it never occurred to me before that he might be. But I really like the idea. I really do. Doc Cavazos totally screwed up the Mongols because he was an undercover federal agent. Brilliant! Just brilliant! Love it! The ATF should have been paying him.

    For real, I think the ATF is paying him now.

    your pal,
    Rebel

  16. THAT DUDE Says:

    WHAT ABOUT DOC’S TATTOO’S HE SURE HAD ALOT OF MONGOL TATTOO’S ON HIS CHEST.. THIS RAT WELL HAVE TO SLEEP WITH ONE EYE OPEN FOR THE REST OF HIS LIFE NOT ONLY DO THE MONGOLS WANT HIM BUT IM SURE THERE WELL BE ALOT OF 1%ER CLUBS ALSO LOOKING FOR HIM.. THIS HAPPEND TO ONE CLUB AND IT WONT BE THE LAST.. IT’S A SAD DAY!! AMERICA HOME OF THE FREE & THE FREEDOM OF SPEECH MY ASSSS….

  17. Sohn Says:

    Dear Rebel and who ever else cares,
    I’m sure that in “Doc’s” deal he gets to keep a shit load of his “criminal proceeds”, sure there will be the token forfeiture of some money and assets but it will be the typical ruse played out for the ordinary Joe. And on paper he may be an indigent right now, but in a federal court that probably means he has no liquid assets. I’m willing to bet that the only reason the punk held out the whole three months is to get one of the sweetest deals in fed history.
    As my contention has always stated, Ciccone moved on this the second that week @$$ lame was kicked out. That case probably had close to a year before the feds were going to close it and indict anyone. The only reason they waited to unseal their indictment (the predicate acts stop shortly after Doc gets kicked out) in October is that they [the feds] were pushing their C.I. in Carson (Dan “Cucumber” Corigan or CI-6) and their under-covers to get as many people (Mongol or not) during Street Vibrations caught up in a case. As a matter of fact, the police in Nevada stated that the Northern Nevada case or Operation Domino was only closed down because the unsealing of Operation Black Rain. Street Vibrations 08 was at least the fourth consecutive year that Ciccone came to Reno following around C.I.s but probably his and the A.T.F.’s most successful. “ATF said it named the effort “Operation Domino” because one investigation led law enforcement to the next and so on”, Over 100 undercover operations and 23 arrests in a little over a year. I’ve heard that it has spawned at least 7 more rats and almost as many C.I.s (mostly hearsay knowledge but from reliable sources non the less).
    And as far as any club being happy with this, I seriously doubt it. Almost every state that the Mongols expanded into during his tenure as leader (or sudo-leader under Pinney as he claims) has problems now, including but not only limited to heavier law enforcement scrutiny. So, I doubt anyone loves that moron.
    As far as going after the KKK’s or the Nazi’s intelectual property, who would want it? What is its worth? I think the Mongol brand actually had and may still have a positive value. Also, I think the government is trying to be Nazi without alerting anyone to that fact; it would be counter productive for them to fly that banner!

  18. JAMES Says:

    This is so interesting of a site, I really do ejoy reading the articles and all of the comments posted, as for one, it is most imformative, not the shit as seen in the newspapers, as I see it MR. REBEL runs a very UNBIASED SITE,I wish to praise him for that, as far as DOC CAVASOS, what a PIECE OF GARBAGE, when shit catches up to him he does like a little kid TAKES HIS BALL AND GOES HOME, GAME OVER.He is a thief and brought in C-I#6 who was an 81 PROSPECT untill they messed him over as he claimed, then decides to take out his embarrassment on the only people who would have him or any OTHER OUT BAD PIECES of shit, ROGER PINNEY did not do any of this, if you knew you would know all of the MONGOLS real troubles began when DOC took the helm which he INHERITED after the LAUGHLIN INCIDENT, which he PERSONALLY helped to esculate, MR. PINNY as I have it really did not want to be a PRES. but was talked into it by a fast talker as DOC and his buddy J.C.,they were running the CLUB, as MR.PINNEY was only PRES. in name only as DOC and his uderlings wanted control and could only take control by having someone appoint them to an office, since they did not have the amount of time to be a NAT. OFFICER, bad move on MR. PINNEYS PART, good move for the upcoming events to start the ball rolling, and if anyone who has read DOCS BOOK, knows anything of him, they wil know he highly FABRICATED the things he braggs about that he has done, as the same with his good friend WILLIAM QUEEN, so as to boost sales, just a few things that I feel needed to be posted, so all the NON-CLUB BOOK READING BLIEVE EVERYTHING YOU READ might like to read, and just for the record, maybe you can decide whether or not to believe all of this or not,REBEL KEEP UP THE GOOD JOB,JAMES

  19. JAMES Says:

    Has anyone been reading the site postings of KEVIN( SPIKE1%er ) O’NIELL of the OUTLAWS M.C ? You can find it at, http://www.hopeful4support.blogspot.com/ For those who want to hear and read something very interesting about the tactics used by our GOV. and its OFFICES of LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES, I suggest this site will help to open a few eyes as to what is going on around and within, LATER JAMES

  20. Doc Jones Says:

    After Cavazos gets through snitching on as many people that he can, and the Feds are done with him, he, his son and his brother will go into hiding. Cavazos is an X-Ray Tech. That’s all he knows. I believe he will get a job at a hospital somewhere. There are so many people out to get him that I doubt he will be able to hide forever. He is too much of an egomaniac to keep really low. He’ll make some money on another book and may appear on TV in disguise telling about how he had to rat because his conscious was getting to him and it was the right thing to do. He will have to work at some point. I think that he is the perfect one to be found, even if he’s in a protection program. There are people from all walks of life who work in hospitals. What an awful life, always looking over your shoulder. How horrible it must feel to know that you are a rat ass punk snitch!! The President of “the most violent motorcycle club” according to the feds and the media. HAW!! He is a poor representative of the Mongols. He’s not even a man!!

  21. Rebel Says:

    Dear Sohn,

    Thanks. Some things just went click in my head.

    Rebel

  22. Rebel Says:

    Dear James,

    I am reading Kevin O’Niell now. Thank you.

    Rebel

  23. Sohn Says:

    Dear James
    The 81 kicked CI#6 out because they had “paper work” on him; they also told everyone that asked the reason why. There’s roughly 250,000 people in northern Nevada yet CI#6 was a full patch Mongol member within a month or two of being kicked out. That right there shows an EXTREME lack of DUE DILIGENCE if any at all. The recruitment of gangbangers wasn’t the only problem with “Doc’s” membership drive, taking other clubs “trash” (I don’t want ANYONE to take this as meaning that I think if someone doesn’t make it into one club or another that they’re garbage, not every club is right for everyone and people sometimes have to look around to see where they fit in. I can respect a man more for the journey that he takes than the destination he obtains.) seems to have played as big if not even bigger role in their downward spiral. Of course, they still have a punchers chance; hopefully, they’ll [the Mongols] see this through to the end.

  24. JAMES Says:

    SOHN, CI#6 no matter what the circumstance, OUT BAD irregardless, NO CLUB should take another 1% OUTLAW CLUBS TRASH PERIOD,and if they had paper on his ass they should present it to all 1% CLUBS and any CHAPTERS of a CLUB they find out he has gone to, not blaming the 81 for not doing so since sometimes when you have no communcation between CLUBS this happens, but I have also heard stories of PAPERWORK that is just someone trying to stop a person from going elsewhwere, when he may not be out bad at all.I personally am not a big fan of SNITCHJACKETS, SHOW ME SOME PAPER!, that is the right way to make sure a guy like this stays out of anybodys CLUB, I don’t believe even DOC CAVASOS would have taken him in with some real proof, I don’t buy that story especially just rumors, if you do then hopefully nobody ever starts one about you, JAMES

  25. Sohn Says:

    James
    You’re absolutely right, a snitch jacket is something that shouldn’t be thrown out unless there is proof. I would also agree that in this case the Mongols and 81 weren’t talking(for obvious reasons); therefore, the Mongols should have looked into this allegation on their own with a fine tooth comb. And, in the end ones personal protection is up to one’s self and not others. No prospecting period and giving CI#6 a patch virtually over night has proven disastrous to what I believe innocent people. A disaster that could have been avoided with a little footwork. I didn’t mean to suggest that anyone in the Mongols was to take the word of him being a rat as the voice of god to babes, but in a small town where everyone knows everyone’s business some investigating was in order. One could use all the same old cliché, hind sight is 20/20, an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure and so on. Yet in the end, when things go south, one inevitably only has one’s self to blame and that was my gist.

  26. DirtyBruin Says:

    Just the idea that anyone was getting a full Mongols patch without prospecting is mind-boggling. I can only imagine how pissed off men must have been who’d been members for years and who had to work their tails off as a prospect to get their patches seeing these new guys waltzing in.

  27. Joseph S Says:

    Anyone wanna speculate on the future of Lil Rubes and Al the Suit? By the way take a look at the pictures on his website, all three were a lot thinner.

  28. T-Dogg Says:

    Well this is no surprise!! The Mongols MC is dead because they were infiltrated by a (Doc) no good gangbanging beaner rat. As a 1%er, I can say I am sorry to see the Mongols dismantled but that happened 10 years ago when Doc came around the Mongols. Before that they were a real MC. Now they’re just a bunch of gang-banging bitches who have zero understanding of loyalty, honor, respect & brotherhood.

    Doc’s “Mongols” have taught us that if you do stupid shit and involve your club, the Feds will pull your patch. That said if you are outlaw motorcycle club and behave like it, while the cops will still be a pain in your ass, your club & culture will survive! There is no brotherhood in business.

    Unfortunately for the Mongols that joined hoping they belonged to a real outlaw motorcycle club, they are now club-less and I can’t imagine too many outlaw clubs will be willing to bring in any former Mongols.
    Fuck Doc and his mexi-rats!!!

  29. T-Dogg Says:

    Oh yeah, Lil Rubes and Al have most likely taken pleas as well. We’ll see when they unseal the rest of the pleas, but there is no reason for them not to since they were both booted out of the club with Doc.

  30. Anonymous Says:

    T-Dog, your a fucking idiot. Yes dog fucked shit up and turned out to be a snitch. and yes so did a few others. but so far 22 sealed pleas are on the table. there is no guess how many of the 22 are are snitches. Even if they all are 22 out of the medias est of 600 Mongols does not make them a business club, or mexi snitches as you call them.

    The Mongols motorcycle club has always had respect from other major 1%er clubs and still does to this day, regardless that a minority of the club turned out to be rotten apples, the majority of the club still stands strong in brotherhood and is sticking together.

    so lets not make attacks about the club. you want to talk shit on the snitches have at it, but do not make assumptions about things you know nothing about.

    The Mongols motorcycle club still holds strong with more brotherhood and loyalty than every before. So calling them gangbanging bitches is retarded.

    know what your talking about before you open your mouth. or find a Mongol and tell him what you think and see how it goes for ya.

    And to everyone else bantering on about CI6 get over it. he was a fucking drug addict retard and a pathological liar. though he is responsible for a few arrests he had no major impact on this case. it was the CI that brought in the ATF in Nevada and LA that brought the damage.

    Respects to Rebel for keeping us all up to date on this case.

  31. Rebel Says:

    Dear Joseph S and T-Dogg,

    Don’t know about the other two Cavazos. I do know that about a month after Doc made his deal, two more sealed plea agreements were entered on February 27. That was just about the time, almost to the minute, that the prosecution started leaking the story that “Mongols were making deals.”

    And I, since I am old school stupid, wrote a story saying, “Oh no. The Mongols are all standing tall. This is just the prosecution talking. Putting pressure on the defendants.”

    Then it was about two weeks after that that the other sealed plea deals started being made. I have written a little bit about Ruben Junior on this page.

    Anybody can follow the trail of breadcrumbs. It is a pretty clear trail. I cannot actually say whether it leads to the truth or not until I have the documents in front of me. Maybe it is a false trail.

    I keep thinking that the government is smarter than it is. I will tell you that. The banana peel I keep slipping on is I keep thinking Ciccone and the whole prosecution team is smarter than they are. I am not even sure if Ciccone is smart enough to read this page.

    But just in case he is, I try not to give him any ideas he might not already have. I am not sure how many dots these guys see. I keep wondering, though, what has Doc been talking about for the last six months? You know, while he is getting his tattoos lasered off. The Dodgers? Carbs versus fuel injection? I don’t know what Al would know. But I do know that Lil Rubes liked to wear an Oakland side rocker. I sort of think the apple did not fall far from the tree.

    T-Dogg, the reason for not unsealing the pleas is that it might offer clues as to what, and who, the cooperating defendants are discussing. And, I bet there is a Grand Jury listening to testimony right this second.

    Sometimes I look at stuff that is going on nationally and I wonder, you know, where Doc might fit in and how much he knows. I see a lot of dots.

    The Highwaymen case in Detroit. Just to grab a ball out of the air. Yemeni club president in Detroit. Yemeni entrepreneurs in Canada. Is that connected? Who knows?

    Doc seemed to have appointed himself ambassador to the Pagans. Mongols from California flew to Indianapolis to have a bar fight? Mongols in the Netherlands? All this talk in the indictment and the warrants and even some of the available transcripts about the Mexican Mafia? Who told the last Grand Jury that the SOS had “greenlighted” the Mongols? Where did shit like that come from? Was that Ciccone? How did he know? Did he make that up? Lot of questions in this case. Lots of dots.

    How much could Doc know? What could he give up to save his life and buy freedom for a couple of people he loves? He gave up something. The ATF has been concentrating on motorcycle clubs ever since the Waco fiasco. And, they have been striking out time after time. Yeah they got Taco Bowman. Made a little, bullshit, conspiracy case against the Bandidos. Other than that?

    Now they sure look to me like they think they have finally hit a home run and justified all that effort they put into motorcycle clubs.

    I knew Doc flipped a long time ago. So did you. When I finally started thinking, “Well, what if all the Mongols are not standing tall,” I looked and I could see it was him. Had to be. Pretty obvious. I just could not say it out loud until the other day. I sat on it for about three days trying to find something more. I finally ran it when I thought the AP or the el lay Times or somebody was going to make me look even stupider than I am. What has me stumped now though is, how much can Doc give up?

    I am not even going to say what I am really thinking.

    Thanks for commenting, both of you. Thanks for reading.

    Rebel

  32. Joseph S Says:

    Dear T-dogg,
    Think your right. All they have is each other know. The walls are closing in.

  33. Sohn Says:

    You know 22 out of 600 is a good point. In 1999 the Rampart police scandal involved about 20 officers; I can’t imagine there being much more then 600 Rampart cops. One is looking at less than 4% corruption; I wonder when someone should consider the fruit poisonous. I know that I’ve eaten food after dissecting the rotten portion and the meal was perfectly fine.
    The problem arises though that in our world we only have a problem with 30 people or less in this indictment. In the larger public’s view there’s closer to a hundred bad apples. The smart thing to do would be to persuade the greater majority into looking at things in our light (which after all is the right way) and not in the fog that the DOJ has cast. Calling people names on public forums, who we all know suffer the same plight, isn’t going to get any of us ahead.

  34. Onnray Says:

    hmmm, anyone ever consider that from the original indictments, a second round of arrests will be following? That will come simply from guys like Doc that are giving ppl up. Then after those arrests…you think everyone arrested is going to stand solid? I hardly think the dust has settled from all this, nor all the damage done..and after you rinse and repeat this process two or three times…how well do you think the brotherhood of “trust” is going to be surviving? Anyone that is solid would have to distance himself from the group out of that uncommon thing they call common sense………jmo

  35. JAMES Says:

    I would say 22 out of 600 and NOBODY knows for sure exactly what is being said, or how many are giving up anything,if you would look at any photos and any documentaries you would see DOC with about the same number, and faces in all the different views and places, that’s about what his onturage totalled,so maybe all they have is the ones he traveled with ratting out each other,nomatter what anyone has to say on this or any other site you cannot blame every member for the bad apples produced by the goings on at the heads of the table, some people had no idea and then some maybe just wanted to ride and have a good time thinking it was a feww doing crap on their own which I would believe would be the real deal.

  36. Onnray Says:

    http://www.ocregister.com/articles/members-mongols-gang-2486907-cavazos-murder

  37. Sohn Says:

    Onnray reminds me of something that I told some of my friends around spring and that is that Doc, by his own account, met with and corresponded with influential members of other clubs. It’s been my experience that the DOJ will introduce phone records of a rat, have him lie about what was said during the conversation and then have the object of their attack have to prove differently. Something that can be very difficult since the conversation is generally over a couple years old and usually unremarkable or memorable to begin with.

  38. FTF Says:

    Sohn

    You are right as rain on that one. Doc is a great liar, and it’s obvious to the world now. I am wondering how many people he’s actually going to try and bring down with him in all of this. If he’s only looking at 20 years max, I’d have to say he is about to lie on a lot of people, Mongols, and others as well.

  39. supporter Says:

    Doc is a virus that infected the mongols. If Doc wouldnt have opened his mouth about anything that the club was doing, including being on Gangland and writing a book, The Mongols would still be having a good time riding and enjoying life. Now because he wanted to look like a bad ass, The Brothers cant even hold a party without the damn ATF comming after them…ITS NOT AGAINST THE LAW TO BE A BIKER..

  40. Doc Jones Says:

    Hey Rebel,
    Do you know if anyone has been arrested after Cavazos and the others turned rat?

  41. THE DUDE Says:

    With all the flipping going on, like Onnray said, are there going to be more arrests? If they are turning rat, then there are other people involved. The ATF is still watching them for a reason and not letting them have their parties, so you know more people are going down. It looks like those guys can’t do anything with the ATF watching them. Rebel, thanks for the updates. I really enjoy the nonbiased forum you have here are taking responsibilty when you are wrong.

  42. Rebel Says:

    Dear The Dude,

    Just out of curiosity, are you the “The Dude.” If you are, thanks for reading. I appreciate it. Thanks for commenting. This Bud’s for you, partner. If not, you should know there is only one “The Dude.”

    your pal,
    Rebel

  43. Rebel Says:

    Dear Doc Jones,

    Loaded question. Yeah, there have been additional charges. I do not know if you can actually lay this on Doc. The way these investigations always go is: First they get the indictment; then they lock up the suspects; then they try to charge them with something that will stick.

    your pal,
    Rebel

  44. Joseph S Says:

    Well people in cyberland, where and how do you think Doc is gonna do his time???

  45. THAT DUDE Says:

    This is just fucking amazing. I have no words for what the goverment plans next. Shit NY cant even fix the fuckin budget. CA cant even pay the people back income tax yet they find money to shut clubs down.

    I quote CA’s income tax site, “Without action by the Governor and Legislature to stave off a severe cash deficit of almost $3 billion at the end of July, the Controller will be forced to issue individual registered warrants, also called IOUs, beginning July 2.” IO fucking U’s yet the police agancy’s and the goverment find money to waste on shutting a bike club down.

    AMAZING

  46. Doc Jones Says:

    I just read that 19 members from the Toonerville Gang were arrested in Glendale. The article implied that this gang was responsible for gunning down a Mongol on Interstate 210 last October. The article also states that Glendale police used a wiretap and used the evidence gathered to make the arrests. I never heard of this gang. I can’t keep up with all the gangs and clubs these days.

  47. Rebel Says:

    Dear Doc,

    Yeah. I’m looking at writing the story. The Toonerville clique is named for an old section of LA City called Toonerville. I will put something vanilla up on this this afternoon. Really, the story here, is that the Mongols made a lot of enemies outside the MC world and that there are wiretaps everywhere. That is what is really going on. What I think I will not say but I will say something.

    Later,
    Rebel

  48. bobo Says:

    wow what a suprize a spic rat no way man

  49. To Anonymous Says:

    I don’t think you are qualified to say the Mongols “have always had the respect of other major 1% clubs.”

    There may have been alliances for mutual benefit. That is not the same as respect.

    At any rate, what “respect” there may have been was pretty much shit canned, I think, when video cameras caught dozens of them tossing their colors into trash cans (as also noted in the official court records) while exiting the casino in Laughlin.

    Please correct me if I am wrong.

  50. Anonymous Says:

    In the 1970′s a large well known motorcycle club tried to bully and intimidate a much smaller band of brothers from East LA who called themselves the Mongols. This big club tried to tell the Mongols what they could and couldn’t do. The Mongols told them to fuck off and stood their ground. The big club threatened them, attacked them and even killed a few of them, but the Mongols stood their ground. The bigger club finally backed down, and the Mongols earned the right to be the only other club in California to wear a California rocker. when the Mongols ran an article giving all the clubs permission to wear that rocker, a ton of clubs jumped on the bandwagon. Wearing a patch the Mongols earned in blood and brotherhood.

    The same small club, The Mongols, eventually established a chapter in an area known to be exclusive to the major club, Nor Cal. And all the other clubs thought the Mongols would get killed, or run off. But again the Mongols held there ground, stood tall and won a fight no one thought they could win. The Mongols have since grown all over Northern California.

    Laughlin….I don’t think the Mongols lost any respect from anyone in Laughlin. In the public eye the Mongols stood their ground, Highly out numbered and out gunned. They stood and defended themselves and the whole world saw it. 3 of the attackers where killed, and two Mongols died defending their brothers. As far as a few members removing their colors, the place was swarming with Police, five people lay dead on the floor and the cops where grabbing everyone wearing colors. So some members didn’t want to be arrested. I don’t think anyone with half a brain judged those members for what they did.

    Everyone thought after Laughlin the Mongols would be shut down from this bigger club, but that day never came. In fact the Mongols continued to grow larger.

    And now the government is trying to bully the Mongols. Trying to take their patch and shut down their club. Just like the big club tried to do over the last 30 years. And just like the Mongols did with the big club, they are sticking together and fighting back. They have not given up or resigned to be defeated. They have not given in nor changed their patch, or stopped being the Mongols. Countless runs and parties since than have proven this. The Mongols remain visible and standing their ground side by side.

    You continue to read stories of members “ratting” and other negative press. But to be honest you continue to read about the same 30 people. The media estimates the Mongols nation at over 600 members nationally, but you continue to judge the Mongols on the actions of 30 people. You continue to read about these few in Southern California, but you don’t read about the Mongols who have earned the right to wear their colors in Oklahoma, Florida, Colorado, Virginia, Montana, Oregon, Washington, ETC. These chapters also stood together and fought to earn the right to wear those bottom rockers in their states. The Mongols have since grown into Mexico, Canada, Italy and Germany. But you will still only read about those 30.

    The fact stands that the Mongols Motorcycle club have earned their reputation and yes, have earned the respect from other 1%er clubs as well as other clubs all over the world for always standing up for themselves and never backing down. You can find stupid little rumors, or argue any of these points, but nothing will change. The Mongols MC will always stand tall, and the 5% that are giving them a bad name will not affect the respect the other 95% have earned.

  51. THE ONE Says:

    Anonymous:

    HIT IT ON THE NAIL.

  52. Doc Jones Says:

    I’m certain that all clubs have had rats and other embarrassments. Maybe there is a small percentage of Mongols who couldn’t hold their mud. The problem with growing fast is that you increase the chance of getting scrap in your club. One thing for sure—–the Mongols didn’t give a shit about anyone except Mongols. They have many enemies but they still managed to stay strong. Then, Cavazos gave up everything to the Feds. In my opinion he along with the others who turned rat have effectively allowed the Feds to destroy the Mongols. Even the ones who didn’t have their records sealed helped the Feds in their effort. If you plead guilty to count one and admit that other Mongols were involved, you’re giving up the club. RICO is no joke especially if members are scared into cooperating. I hope I’m wrong and the Mongols survive. This case has the potential to affect all clubs.

  53. pete Says:

    the mongols mc r here to stay!!!!!!!!

  54. JAMES Says:

    The MONGOLS as any other 1% CLUB will always do as they please and if people do not like it so what, the rest of the 1% CLUBS also do the same and anyone who says differant knows nothing about 1% CLUBS, they all do as they please and only the strong suvive by setting up in different areas, people on this and any other sites saying RESPCT is lacked because the MONGOLS did not go ask, well what about the other CLUBS, how many do they ask, just the way it goes, sometimes things are talked about and agreed on, well sometimes there isn’t asking and that is a fact of life, you won’t get respect sometimes but you back the plays of your CLUB.Nobody in tyhese CLUBS care what a bunch of citizens like or not, if you are frinds or a supporter of one of the CLUBS you should know and if you don’t ask one of the ones you know.

  55. DirtyBruin Says:

    Anonymous: please speak only for yourself.

    “I don’t think the Mongols lost any respect from anyone in Laughlin.” Well, you’re wrong. Granted, I take what the mainstream news says about any 1% club – hell, about any biker – with a couple large grains of salt, but when I heard the report that some Mongols had thrown away their colors, my immediate reaction was “If that’s true, that’s disgusting.” Later on, I heard stories about Mongols riding in small groups without their colors to stay “under the radar” – and again, my reaction was that if it was true, it was disgusting. Since we’ve had credible reports of some guys getting bumped to full patch status in the Mongols without having to prospect, I’m a lot more inclined to believe those old reports of disrespect for the colors. Now, does my opinion matter one way or the other to the Mongols? No. But you’re still wrong.

    I read lot of bragging in what you write here – fine, but what’s it accomplished? According to Rebel’s reporting, the chances of the Mongols keeping their club identity are vanishingly small; the government will take the patch design, and the club as it has been known will be no more. I’m no intellectual property lawyer so I can’t say what might happen with the chapters in other countries – but if you think what happens here in California won’t affect the chapters in other states, you’re out of your freaking mind.

    I would not be surprised if there were plenty of long-time Mongols who were pissed over Doc’s rise to power, over bringing in gangbangers who didn’t even ride motorcycles, of handing out patches like carnival prizes – but the point is, they didn’t do anything effective to stop it. Sure, Doc got voted out in bad standing – AFTER all the damage was done. Where was the outrage over him transferring ownership of the CLUB TRADEMARKS to a corporation he personally controlled BEFORE the feces impacted the rotating air distributor?

    As for the “California” rocker – I honestly don’t know much about inter-club politics, but I attended the 81′s annual swap meet in the Valley in early June, and I saw a number of men attending from a variety of other clubs that were flying a “California” bottom rocker, and it wasn’t a problem that I could see. I can say that I saw no members of a certain other club that’s had a recent dispute with the 81 there, and I’ve seen them at 81 events in the past. From this I deduce that if the 81 had a problem with other clubs wearing such a rocker at their event … those rockers would probably not have been there. So I’m not sure your claim about the effect of the Mongols declaring open season on the “California” rocker has a lot of merit to it.

    As I’ve said before – this case sets horrible precedents, and I wish it hadn’t happened. But ignoring the facts is simply delusional.

  56. troyez Says:

    The more I hear about this case, the more I think Doc brought all this on himself (I know, it’s been said before). The huge thing that brought it on (in my opinion) was bringing in members of a certain Hispanic gang with a history of only murder, robbery, drug dealing, etc. There is no question of what that Hispanic gang is about, crime, period. If you bring criminals into your club, law enforcement will instantly step up surveillance and consider you a criminal organization. Think about this: if the Boy Scouts began recruiting members of this Hispanic gang, would the law check them out? So, the Mongols were a 1% club who brought in professional criminals, and people are surprised at what happened to them? It was only a matter of time. Dance with the devil and you’ll get burned.

  57. To Anoymous Says:

    Anonymous, when you consider that Mongols colors were the ONLY colors found discarded, I think that sort of blows your theory.

    Why were so many mongols cuts found? Perhpas because those who so easily tossed them did not have to “earn” them. They had no respect for them, thus no respect is given. When you see black and white checkered flannel shirts being worn under a Mongols cut, you know that is a throw back to the street gang mentality.

    A street gang has a different mentality than does a 1% club.

    As to your reference to a “large 1% club”, we all know who you mean. No riddles needed.

    By contrast, I know specifically where a long time member of a large 1% club had a horrific (and ultimately fatal) motorcycle crash. As he lay broken and dying, his last request to his Brother was to ask them to shove his helmet under his upper back (which had been broken in numerous places), so that he would not die with his patch touching the ground. This is not an urban myth, but it IS worthy of absolute respect.

    Let’s review your claim:

    Bandidos: No repsect there. Doc pissed them off by trying to patch over some Canadian Bandidos. Some did defect.

    HA- self explanatory.

    Pagans- Highly doubtful, though the indictment says overtures were made.

    Outlaws: Hmmm. Apparently at Doc’s orders, Mongols were to attack OL bars in Mid Western states. Might be one of those “the enemy of my enemy is my friend” things, but again, that is not respect.

    You got Roger on You Tube whining about Doc, and Doc on Gangland so in love with himself..

    Doc balsted a certain chapter for allowing Billy Queen in and got “out bad”. Yet under his rule, 5 times the number of ATF agetns infilitrated the club.

    Now apprently Le Eme took out “Hitman”. Maybe, just maybe, everyone BUT the Mongols saw this coming, and just backed off until it did.

    Bullying you say? How about self implosion? How about giving out patches like Boy Scout merit badges? Listen, no less than FOUR full time ATF agents were patched into this “club” in a space of 10 years.

    You may ask why (but I doubt it). The obvious answer is that the greed factor overuled any semblance of untiy, loyalty and lastly brotherhood.

    No tall standing here.

  58. THAT DUDE Says:

    YOU SAID IT ALL heard stories YOU KNOW THE MEDIA, PIGS THEY DO ALL THEY CAN DO TO STIR SHIT UP..According to Rebel’s reporting, the chances of the Mongols keeping their club identity are vanishingly.. A REPORTER THATS HIS JOB SOME OF THESE ASSHOLES ARE HERE TO PUT LIES AND MAKE STORYS UP.. I WAS AT THE LAST MONGOL BASH WERE THE PIGS TOOK A BOX OF SHIRTS NONE OF THE SHIRTS HAD THE TRADEMARK OR THE MONGOL NAME ON IT..YEA THERE WERE ALOT MONGOLS WHO WERE PISSED AT DOC HE HAD THE POWER U WENT AGAINST HIM HE THROW U OUT HE HAD HIS GOONS HE HAD WITH HIM ALL THE TIME THAT WOULD THROW OUT MEMBERS IF U WENT AGAINST HIM .. THE CALFORNIA ROCKER THERES ONLY TO CLUBS WHO KNOW HAVE HAD THE RIGHT TO FLY THE BOTTOM ROCKER ALL THESE OTHER CLUBS HAD NO PROBLEM CAUSE THE ANGELS DID NOT WANT TO GO TO WAR THEY HAD TRYED WITH THE MONGOLS AND HAD NO SUCCESS MONGOLS HAD WON THAT RIHGT THE WAR WHAT EVER U WANT TO CALL IT TO WEAR THAT BOTTOM ROCKER.

  59. Doc Jones Says:

    I agree with James. 1% clubs care about their club and first, above all else. Then there are the support clubs. I don’t get the idea of being in a club that is under the wing of another club. I’ve seen many support clubs on the various runs I’ve attended and many of them wear the California bottom rocker. Another thing I’ve noticed is there are way to many clubs to keep up with. There are clubs for law Enforcement, Firefighters, Union Workers, Christians, Battered Children and many more. The biggest club of all is an owners club. When I bought my Harley I automatically became a member. I guess I was a prospect during the time I was waiting for approval for my loan. It seems that there are many people who have a need to belong to something. The 1 per centers are the real deal. Mongols are the real deal. Even if you hate them, they deserve respect. I’m reminded of when they moved into Oregon. They didn’t ask permission from anyone. They moved into many parts of Northern California without asking permission. It’s sad that a few of them gave up their manhood and turned rat. If the Mongols become owned by the Feds that may be the beginning of the destruction of all clubs.

  60. Anonymous Says:

    Some valid points have been made, but everyone on here seems to keep relying on rumor. The fact of the matter is many of you had your minds made up well before you read this article or any other. you may support another club, or dislike the Mongols but for whatever reason you are clearly talking based on speculation and things you have read or heard in the media.

    FACT: The Mongols MC are the first club other than the HA to wear the California bottom rocker. They earned it. All the other clubs wore SO cal, LA etc. As time progressed the Ha gave some clubs permission and the Mongols gave clubs permission. but just because you saw other clubs wearing it within the last 10 years doesn’t mean they earned it. in the 70s, 80s, and early 90s nobody wore the California rocker other than the Mongols and the HA.

    As far as talking in riddles go, you all know the score so why blast the names over and over?

    And seriously? wearing a flannel shirt under your cut makes you a “gangbanger” now? that is ridicules. you mean to tell me that only gang members wear flannel shirts?? where do you get this from? that may simply be one of the dumbest things that has been written in this post so far.

    And what is this shit about people giving away patches?? again some of you read or believe only what you want to believe. On Doc’s own admission he came into the club without prospecting because he charted a new chapter. many clubs probate new members when they charter new chapters. Being a probationary member may not be prospecting but it is certainly not giving away a patch like a “carnival prize”. Many of the other big clubs do similar things. If any of you were in a 1%er club you would know these things.

    In the history of the Mongols there has been 5 ATF agents infiltrate the club. 4 of them prospected, took lie detector tests and earned their patch. So don’t assume that the reason they got in was because the Mongols gave away patches as you say. Is everyone forgetting the ATF agents that infiltrated the Sons of Silence? The entire chapter that infiltrated the Warlocks? How about the entire chapter that infiltrated the Angels in Arizona? The list goes on and on.

    Just because a tv program says that the Mongols recruited part time members doesn’t mean it is true. and if you happen to own the gangland series you will see that they edited anything to do with ‘part time” members out of the Mongol episode because it was not true.

    and who gives a shit if ex gang members grew up and decided they wanted to be in a MC? are you saying because you used to be in a street gang that you shouldn’t be allowed to ride a bike, or join a club?
    so you believe that the thousands of other clubs in the USA don’t allow ex gang members to join their club?

    Some of you have clearly picked what club you support so you have come to your own conclusions, but do not consider these conclusions to be fact.

    As far as respect from other clubs your theory again is loosely, very loosely based on rumor. According to every news article on the Canadian Bandidos, the US Bandidos stopped recognizing the Canada chapters well before they patched over to Mongols. So them being upset over the patch over is purely ridicules. The Mongols have had a very close relationship with the Outlaws and Pagans and that relationship continues to this day. so again more assumptions on your part.

    Whether you like them or hate them, look at the facts before trying to talk as though your an expert.

  61. Anonymous Says:

    To Dirty Bruin:
    I never said that what happens to the so cal members will not affect the club as a whole. my point was just because a small percentage of people were ratting doesn’t mean the club as whole is full of rats, or just because a small percentage is being accused of illegal activity doesn’t mean the rest of the club is involved in anything illegal.

    In one sentence your saying you don’t believe rumors and in the next you are considering rumors as fact and saying the Mongols lost respect. My original post was about the Mongols having respect from other 1%er clubs. Not from someone who believes everything they hear in the news. So i defiantly wouldn’t say that I was wrong.

    By reading your post it is clear that you do not belong to any 1%er club. You say if a small group of Mongols rides without wearing their patch to keep under the radar they lost your respect. than you talk about supporting a HA event. You are obviously not aware that it is common practice for the HA and other clubs to not always wear their patches either. many club members do not wear their cuts all the time for a list of reasons. If you were in a 1%er club you would understand, especially in so cal that anytime you wear your patch the police pull you over and harass you. The so cal HA along with Vagos and many other clubs also ride without patches sometimes. so if you lost respect for the Mongols because you “heard” they may have been ridding in small groups without patches than please be fair and lose respect for all teh clubs that do it as well.

    So next time you have an opinion, please state it as that. do not call what rumors you choose to believe or disbelieve fact. at the end of your comment you say lets not ignore the facts, however you did not state one fact in your comment.

  62. Sohn Says:

    To Anonymous;
    I’m going to state some facts that are wrong in your post. It’s going to upset some of the Mongol supporters but once again -it’s just facts being stated to set the record strait.
    In Harrah’s at Laughlin there was over 200 Mongols and suporters, info taken from deposition given by Pinney for Barrerah law suite against Harrah’s Casino. Every “attacker” (your word not mine) member, prospect, hang around and a couple of guys that were just standing there were indicted by the Feds; just over 40 guys. On video there was well over 50 Mongol patch holders when the fight broke out. A group of “Attackers”(Your word) were staying at Harrahs, as they did every year for at least the last 8 years or more prior to the incident (thrown in there because I’m sure it’s going to come up on this site). The Mongols never stayed at Harrah’s and in fact didn’t attend Laughlin the prior year after being permanently expelled from The Riverside by Riverside management, which is where they traditionally stayed (once again brought up because it is bound to come back up on this site).The group of “Attackers” (your word) that had stayed at Harrahs all the years prior had checked in a couple of days prior to the Mongols arrival and days before the incident (once again brought up because it’s bound to come up). Two of the “attackers” (you supposition) were killed, three shot total. Two of which had absolutely no weapons on them -knife included. The other “attacker” (your word) had a sheathed knife and died after being taken out of the casino on a stretcher. The third “attackers” (your word) death was a member shot in the back while riding by himself on highway 40. An incident that is believed to of happened before the Laughlin incident but not discovered till after. Every reported incident that week prior to the Laughlin incident was of Mongols jacking up people wearing “attacker” (your word) support shirts.

    The state of Nevada indicted an equal number of “attackers”(your word) and Mongols. 3 “attackers”(your word) had guns (almost all legally possessed) and 3 Mongols had guns (none of which were legally possessed). The first shooter was a Mongol prospect hitting a Vegas resident, not affiliated with the “attackers” (your word) or Mongols, in the buttocks and then firing two shots into a column. One Mongol was killed, a severed aorta by a knife. A severed aorta causes complete blood pressure loss which causes one to immediately collapse. (Total of three deaths in Harrah’s not five). On video, no “attackers” (your word) are anywhere near him when he collapses. After the Mongol prospects shoots, about 40 of the Mongols run away(Doc, the then National Sergeant at Arms being one of the first; I don’t condemn anyone for running when people are shooting, especially when you have no gun) and in that group several discard their patch- prior to the police arriving.(it came out that undercover police were in the casino when the fight broke out so I’m referring to police in uniform). Of course, I only say this now because all that will be charged have been sentenced and have done almost all of their time; so, it can be said without dry-snitching on anyone.

    The Mongols and “the big club” got along really well prior to Doc’s leadership. And in fact, Doc pretty much admits that the clubs had an agreement not to go into each others areas. This is just my opinion mind you, but, one doesn’t earn respect by going back on ones word. And there’s several clubs in California that wore a California bottom rocker well before the Mongols so graciously “ran an article giving all the clubs permission to wear that rocker”.
    Now there’s plenty of things for Mongols to be proud of and a win against the government for their name would be huge, probably the ultimate David vs. Goliath story. And as far as respect goes I’m sure most Mongols will continue to have that as well. But, as is the case in any group, there’s bad apples that don’t deserve respect. It just so happens that in this article its Doc and about twenty other guys who happened to be Mongols so It’s Doc, twenty guys or so and the Mongols that are being talked about.
    And once again, my sincere intentions on this site are to give information that is helpful to like minded people-be they Mexican, Mongol, Gangbangers (not exclusively Mexican),Hispanic, 1% biker, biker or anyone that could be the target of the Blue gang. I don’t think grossly misstating facts helps this though. And I for one, who had a Nevada state ccw on April 22, 2002 and walked into Harrahs with my guns secured on my bike and not on my person take offense at being called an “attacker” by someone that was obviously nowhere near there and has at best inaccurate biased third hand information about things. Especially after fighting a state case and a federal case on that very incident.

  63. Sohn Says:

    April 22, was a typo it’s the 27th of course

  64. Anonymous Says:

    Sohn-
    Your right I was not there, and I’ll admit that my information has been second or third hand. I appreciate your comment and am not offended what so ever. i can admit when I am wrong and I admit that you obviously have better information about the incident than I do.

    I still stand by my original argument, that the Mongols still have plenty of respect and have done a lot in the past to earn it. I agree that Doc did a lot of damage to the club and deserves no respect at all.

    As far as the California rocker issue goes, other clubs may have started wearing the rocker by the time the article came out but there are only two clubs who have earned it. I’m sure we can both agree on that. The others were eventually given permission by one club or another.

    the thing the got me upset enough to post comments on here is citizens stating rumors as facts. in the process i found out i wasn’t doing much different.

    I do not think I’m the smartest person on here, or that I’m always right but sometime feel compelled to put in my two cents.

  65. Anonymous Says:

    Your are right, i have no idea where my brain was when i said 5 died. sometimes i get hyped up and mistype. again i can admit when i was wrong.

  66. Anonymous Says:

    Laughlin-
    The reason i used the term attackers was because in several media reports, and from the mouths of several undercover police officers that were in Laughlin, all reports said the Angels went to the Mongols bar to “take care of business”, as well as the fact that it was an Angel that throw the inital blow (kick).

    As far as the actual numbers are concerned the reason i said the Mongols were out numbered is because from numerous reports and second hand information that it was so late in the evening that many of the Mongols were in their rooms and not on the Casino floor. From the video I see several more Angels than Mongols. I used the term “outgunned” because the majority of the Mongols who were on the floor were ordered to put their weapons up in their room.

    I agree that two Angels were shot to death and one Mongol was stabbed to death, again I don’t know where my mind was when i said 5. As far as the third angel goes there are millions of conspiracy theories and i am not even going to venture into any of them.

    Like i said before, i can admit when i am wrong, and also admit that this thread has gone far off topic. my original post was based on a few simple points I was trying to make:

    1- The Mongols MC have a lot to be proud of and have earned the respect from a lot of other 1%er clubs. I stand by that statement.
    2- The Mongols MC are a motorcycle club and did not hand out patches to new recruits like “carnival prizes”.
    3- For people to see that a few bad apples have not ruined the bunch.

    The rest is argumentative, and theories and statements i have used to back up these points. some have been proven incorrect but my 3 points remain intact.

    No more arguing for me on this topic for it has gotten far off point.

  67. Sohn Says:

    Dear Anonymous,
    I’m glad, I understand how emotions work. I have them too. I’m guilty of over analyzing things to the point of ridiculousness and other things as well.

  68. To Anonymous Says:

    Facts: (feel free to verify them)

    1. In order to quickly boost ranks for a two front war against the HA and Le Eme, Doc dropped the basic requirment central to any other 1% club that: you had to own a motorcycle.

    2. “Street gangs” do not wear three piece patches. They do wear “colors” of some sort. The Federal Bureau of prisons recognizes this to the point that no Federal facility allows inmates to wear blue or red clothing. Certain California street gangs, mostly of Mexican American origin, wear checkered flannel shirts with their “colors” scheme. I do not make this up.

    3. Mongols recruited from street gangs continued this “tradition”; as well as wearing the Mongols patch. I do not make this up.

    4. In these instances, the Mongols (Doc) DID hand out patches like carnival prizes. I do not make this up.

    As Sohn cited, many Mongols (presumably “newbies”) discarded their cuts before the Police arrived. One possible reason? You cannot respect what you have not earned. I do not make this up.

    As to Laughlin, NINE eye witneses testified they saw a Mongol strike the first blow. Just because the video shows an encapsulation and a member of the other team doing a kick, does NOT mean that was the first blow. I do not make this up, read the court transcripts.

    Prior to even this, it is a FACT that earlier in the day, the Mongols approached and overturned a vendor’s table where support items were being sold on behalf of the other team.

    It is also a FACT that Mongols surrounded one member of the other team (who was alone) and demanded he remove his colors.

    Members of the other team made a decision after enduring many hours of what anyone would call remarkable restraint under such brazen harassment.

    As for the California rocker, it is a well established tradition that the dominant club in any state be approached (out of respect) concerning both bottom rockers and three piece patches. In response to being respectfully reminded of this, the Mongols actually changed both top and bottom rockers to the colors of “red and white” lettering. I do not make this up.

    Respect? I suppose it could be said the Mongols “won’ the right to their bottom rocker; but the truth is more like they were given permission, under certain conditions. Depends on your perspective.

    Either way, the agreement made at the highest levels was not honored. perhaps you dont think honor and respect go together.

    As to your final point about “a few bad apples”, you make my case. A TRUE brotherhood could never have been hijacked like this, period. Whatever the Mongols were, they ceased to be.

    What they will be in the future remains to be seen. By the way I AM a fucking expert.

  69. THAT DUDE Says:

    MAN YOU ARE ALL CLOWNS LEAVE THE PAST OUT OF IT THIS AINT ABOUT ANGELS OR MONGOLS IT’S ABOUT UNCLE SAM REAPING ALL BIKERS A NEW ASSHOLE MONGOLS TODAY ANGELS 2MARROW… WE NEED TO UNITE NOT CRY ABOUT WHO STARTED THE FIGHT BACK IN 02 THESE CLUBS HAVE BEEN AT WAR FOR OVER 30 YRS U CLOWNS ON HERE ARE STRING SHIT UP NO ONE KNOWS THE TRUTH ONLY MONGOL OR ANGEL KNOWS WHAT REALLY WENT DOWN THAT NITE BUT THE END OF IT ALL NO ONE WON BOTH SIDES LOST BROTHERS.

  70. To That Dude Says:

    I post my opinion at the liesure of our host, Rebel. Unless and until he refuses to post one of my comments, or asks me to no longer post, I intend to exercise my right of free speech whether you think I am a clown or not.

    I don’t think reciting facts stirs shit up. I don’t think an exchange of perspectives is anything more than a learning experience. Some people don’t want to learn anything.

    I’ll respect your opinion, but stick with my own.

  71. Flannels Says:

    Dear Mr. Expert-
    So are the Hells Angels and their supporters a street gang because they wear red and white flannels? or what about their red and white bandannas they all wear? Jax from Sons of Anarchy wears and blue and white flannel maybe he was a Sureno. sounds like something street gangs do, and i imagine one of your LEO agencys classifies that as criminal street gang behavior too.

    Man you must be a Mongol if you know for a fact all these things Doc was up to. you knew everything Doc did, and everything that the Mongols did to the “other team”? wow you are one busy guy.

    Maybe your like all the other “OMG Experts”! who taught your class Ciccone or torres?? can you post a picture of your certificate next time please??

    you know just to verify that you are an “Expert”

  72. JAMES Says:

    A wise man once told me,”NOBODY WINS IN A WAR” you would not believe who told me that one, so I won’t.

  73. Docb Says:

    THAT DUDE is right……….. this shit’s about all of us surviving..
    A government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take everything you’ve got.
    Help me underestand…………………. didn’t Doc transfer ownership of the rights to the colors(brand)to himself before the feds took them away in court.
    If that’s right I wonder if a good lawyer could get them back for the club saying that Doc never had the right to give them up since he stole them in the firast place……………. Just wondering
    This situation threatens everybody

  74. DirtyBruin Says:

    Anonymous:

    No, I’m not a 1%er; never claimed to be.

    What I said was that I take any mainstream media reports on bikers with a grain of salt … but when a pattern develops, I pay attention. A pattern developed in the Mongols of people getting in as full patch members who seemed, who appeared to have a shocking lack of respect for those colors. While I obviously don’t know the full details of what any given club puts its prospects through – I do know it’s a hell of a lot of work and requires serious commitment, resulting in most clubs considering their colors to be essentially “holy” and not something to ever be treated in a cavalier manner. Certainly NOT something to be thrown away just to avoid getting arrested!

    If I seemed to state things as fact that aren’t ironclad facts, my apologies. I thought I’d made it clear I’m not in a position to know for certain, and was simply presenting my perspective.

    As for riding patchless – I’m sure members of various 1% clubs do it occasionally, under certain circumstances. The reason I brought it up was the suggestion that was made that it had become routine, nearly SOP. Granted, it’s not a sharp yes/no thing – how much is justifiable, how much just to avoid a minor hassle – but it feeds into the larger pattern I see of at least some Mongols not taking their own colors seriously. A 1%er who’d have to be beaten senseless (as a minimum) before anyone could get his patch is not the kind of man who’d quail from being harassed by police because he’s flying his colors.

    Obviously, you respect the Mongols – and I’ll even agree with you that there’s valid reason for doing so. But your original comment struck me as posturing in the face of what seems like the virtual certainty that the club will be no more when the government takes possession of the club’s trademarks. It is indeed sad that members who did prospect and who did respect the colors will wind up getting screwed by the perfidy and greed of Doc and his circle within the club. I wish the membership who had no part in Doc’s schemes could have found a way to cut out the rot before it took down the club.

    Unfortunately, they didn’t – and the whole biker world will have to contend with the fallout.

  75. Anonymous Says:

    Dirty Bruin
    I agree and hope that the Mongols continue to fight and have a positive out come.

  76. Rebel Says:

    Dear Flannels,

    Not sure what you are arguing with me about.

    What the government is confiscating are the registered “marks:” The name Mongols and the center patch.

    As far as me knowing what Doc was up to, it is a matter of public record that Doc’s cell phone was tapped, his home phone was tapped, there was a “pole camera” outside his front door and after, I think off the top of my head, September 7, 2007, there were video cameras and microphones concealed in his home. I haven’t seen the videos or listened to the tapes but I have seen some of the affidavits. They are part of the public record. Some are still secret because the government wants them to be.

    I am not sure what a motorcycle club expert looks like. Never taken a class from Ciccone or Torres. Never met either one. I no longer ride with a club. But there is a most excellent chance that you do know a club I have ridden with and there is also a fair chance that I rode with a club that went out of business before you were born.

    Tell me what you object to and I will be able to make a more coherent response. The reason for seizing the Mongols patch and name is that Doc Cavazos has admitted that the Mongols are part of his criminal enterprise and more than 20 of his fellow defendants have agreed with him.

    I didn’t do it. Doc did.

    your pal,
    Rebel

  77. Rebel Says:

    Dear Doc B,

    What you are suggesting is exactly what the Mongols Nation Motorcycle Club, Inc. is suggesting.

    But, there are three problems with the objection that Doc stole the patch. One, the corporation probably does not have any legal right to the trademarks, which are the name Mongols and the center patch or logo. Two, the Mongols Motorcycle Club which was a long standing unincorporated association relinquished title to the marks. Three, it doesn’t matter who owns the marks since Doc Cavazos and more than 20 other defendants have stated for the record that Doc made the club into his criminal empire.

    Under RICO law it doesn’t actually matter who owned “the enterprise.” What matters is who was running “the enterprise.” Doc was running it. The only gray area is whether the Mongols Motorcycle Club can actually be proven to have been an enterprise. If it was me, I would describe the Mongols MC as a church. Okay? You with me?

    The government is arguing that the Mongols MC is like a nightclub that a gangster took over for gangster reasons and so the government has the right to seize that night club. Under RICO, it doesn’t matter if you are the legitimate owner of that night club or not. It became a criminal operation. You could not or would not stop it from becoming a criminal enterprise so, tough shit, go get yourself a new night club.

    If I were the Mongols Intellectual Property lawyer I would argue that the Mongols is more like a congregation. I would try that. I would say, just because Jim Jones took over my church doesn’t mean it isn’t still my church.

    That is my opinion, anyway. I am not a lawyer and the Mongols corporation lawyer seems not to agree with me. It would be a very shaky argument at this point, anyway. We will see. It sure looks to me like the trademarks are history.

    And, I also know that a whole lot of people get furious with me and call me a cop or a know-it-all or a yuppie or whatever every time I say that. Personally, I don’t see how trashing me saves the Mongols name and patch. The Mongols are going to lose their patch and their name because Doc Cavazos attracted a ton of attention. The club as a whole attracted a lot of attention. Then the club threw Doc out and Doc decided the best way he could save himself was to flip. I told you this was coming last October. Doc made the case.

    Your pal,
    Rebel

  78. Sohn Says:

    To the Dude:
    Son Stzu was probably the first in recorded history to say nobody wins in a war, translated as something to the effect of war being destructive to both sides, especially prolonged war. And, it still rings true.
    As far as responding to a post about something in 2002, I took offense to it and feel I have every right. Granted, it’s out of the scope on this site, which I stated. But, this isn’t a court room and it was brought in.
    As far as bringing up the past on this site, I agree with you; but one is a fool to forget the past for it’s bound to repeat itself.
    As far as being a clown, maybe you and I can discuss that else where someday. Once again name calling isn’t helpful either.

  79. troyez Says:

    Jeez Rebel,
    Just how “aging,” are you?! You kind of dated yourself by saying the club you rode with, went out of business with the covered wagon! Ha ha! Sorry man, I couldn’t help myself.

    I do like your point about the Mongols defense adopting a “club as a church,” gambit, it is sound.
    Thanks for keeping us informed, chief.
    Troy

  80. To Flannels Says:

    If you have any evidence to refute what I’ve posted, feel free to do so.

    In fact, I began my post with an invitation for anyone to investigate for themselves.

    Flannel, only lazy people make others do all the work.

    I do my own homework.

    The only certificate I have is one that, you know, says I can operate a fork lift probably without causing bodily harm to my co workers.

    Not that I have anything against bodily harm.

  81. JAMES Says:

    MR. TO ANONYMOUS, it is sad to imform you the MONGOLS never, ever CHANGED TO RED AND WHITE PATCH COLORS, that one and a few other statements are incorrect.

  82. Rebel Says:

    Dear Troyez,

    Oh yeah. I am older than some fucking rocks. East coast club. The law caught up to some of those guys in 1984 or 1985. I was in California by that time.

    Rebel

  83. to James Says:

    Never said the patch colors were red and white. What I said was the rocker was….but not for very long.

  84. JAMES Says:

    SORRY TO SAY OLE BUDDY , BUT YOU BETTER REREAD WHAT YOU SAID, YOU SAID BOTH TOP AND BOTTOM, MR. EXPERT, HOW STUPID. END OF CONVERSATION WITH THIS SUBJECT.

  85. To James Says:

    Semantics. A rocker is not a “patch”, but part of a full patch. You cant change history . However, the point I was trying to make is probably lost on you anyway.

  86. JAMES Says:

    YOU REALLY ARE AN IDIOT AND NOT AN “EXPERT”, YOU DID SAY ROCKER, WHICH IS A PART OF THE PATCH, ALSO REFERED TO AS PATCHE,AND IN CONJUNCTION IS A MEMBERS PATCH I HAVE NO MORE TO ARGUE WITH YOU ABOUT BECAUSE YOU ARE AN “IDIOT” AND THIS IS NOT THE PLACE TO ARGUE WITH YOU OVER YOUR SAYING ONE THING THEN ANOTHER.

  87. Joe Gomez Says:

    The Mongol name is over, Doc HAD the copyright / trademark, he sold his soul to the feds (YES HE IS A RAT) and Mongol Joe will be buried. I say the nation remains strong and use the new Black and White Nation name.

  88. T-Dogg Says:

    Anonymous,

    You need to pull your nose out of the bag and find yourself a good 12 step program because you’re so fucking high your babble is rediculous.

    First off, you say that the Mongols have earned the respect of the 1% clubs. I am a member of a major 1% club and every 1%er that I know views the Mongols as gangbaning bitches pretending to be bikers.

    Second, you say that the Mongols didn’t loose any respect for throwing their patches in the garbage at Laughlin. Bullshit!!! What legitamate patcholder would do this??? You didn’t see the HA do this! Why? Because, like I said before these Mongols are just pretending to be bikers and they didn’t earn their patch in the first place!

    Finally, you talk about how they’ve “earned” the respect and right to be in certain states. While I can’t speak about some of the States you mentioned because I have not been involved in the club politicts of that state, I can definately say that the Mongols haven’t earned shit in OR, WA or UT. Hell, in Oregon they recruited “Mooch” and his brother who had both washed out of at least two other outlaw clubs and a bunch of their skinhead buddies. They put on patches on, took some pictures for their myspace pages and have been in hiding since. The entire club community in the Northwest shuns them,they are not welcome at clubhouses or runs, so don’t try and tell us that the 1% clubs respect these bitches.

    Either way, you trying to paint the Mongols as a legitamate MC is just plaint insane. Their former national pres, national Sergant at arms, a couple chapter presidents and others have all plead guilty to count 1 of the RICO indictment and admitted they are a criminal organization. When your national boss and other officers say you are, the defense of “only 4% of the membership was indicted, so there were just a few bad apples” does not hold water because Doc has admitted he was operati g the Mongols as a criminal organization. FYI, Martin Guevara, the current national pres is one of the guys brought in with him when he started the Pick chapter. Martin wasn’t indicted in Black Rain, but what do you want to bet this next round of indictments that will arise out of all the rats will get him and it will also name the Mongols MC as a defendant.

  89. Mooch Says:

    T-Dogg
    your full of shit. maybe you should take your nose out of the bag and have a look around. no one is hiding from anyone.

  90. Mooch Says:

    T-dogg
    here’s the deal homie, saying your in a 1%er club doesn’t mean you are. You clearly have no idea what your talking about, and i could refute anything you had to say about me, my brother or the Oregon and Washington Chapters.

    But that fact of the matter is if you were anybody you could have this conversation with me in person, but you haven’t and I’m willing to wager you never will.

    I’m not into talking shit on the internet. and feel even responding to you gives you some sort of justification, and don’t feel like feeding into it anymore. So i will not respond anymore.

    But do yourself a favor, state your opinion or whatever you want, but leave names out of it. You clearly have no idea what your talking about so unless you can back up any of this shit try keeping your mouth shut.

    Talking shit on the internet is like being in the special Olympics, even if you win, your still retarded. so save the big mouth for the face to face.

    You know who i am, so don’t hide behind a screen name next time, maybe people will take you more seriously. your probably a cop trying to start shit anyways

  91. Not Surprised Says:

    Someone correct me if I am wrong, but to my knowledge, this is the first time a National President of a 1% club punked out.

  92. T Dogg Says:

    Thank you, well said.

  93. FTF Says:

    T-Dogg,

    Let me just say something here. I’m not going to go talking shit on nobody, nor am I going to play internet bad ass. But I’m also not going to sit back and read about how you think I ain’t got the respect of other 1%er’s.

    I’ve been all over the U.S. and HAVE THE RESPECT of everyone I’ve met. I have flown my patch from here to the NW, the midwest, and the east coast, alone and with others. I’ve partied with more good solid Brothers from not only Mongols MC, but just about every other major MC in this country. Never once have I been met with disrespect, nor have I shown disrespect. I am a fucking 1%er, have been since birth. I haven’t owned a cage in over 9 years, all I do is fucking ride, everywhere.

    I don’t know if I can say that there aren’t mistakes that have been made by the leadership of the Mongols MC, and believe me when I say I’m paying in spades for those fucking mistakes. I sit and watch as my club is being dismantled and there isn’t a damn thing I can do about it. I watch as lames are signing away my future, and again there is nothing I can do at this point about it. I can say to you my friend, that although I’m in the shit right now as we speak, I now know exactly who’s a Brother, and who’s not, for sure. When this is over I’ll be right back where I started….a 1%er, and I’ll have sympathy for you and yours when I read about your club being brought down by RICO. I will not sit online and talk out my neck like you have, I will offer my support, and any help I can to help a fellow 1%er who’s fallen on bad times, because that’s what’s in my heart. And what’s in your heart, well, that’s something that’s earned through living the life, and that is what gets RESPECT.

    FYI, and no I didn’t toss my shit in Laughlin, I stood there with my colors on trying to help those in need, and got rolled up, where were you?

  94. JAMES Says:

    NICELY SAID MR. FTF, ONE WHO KNOWS ALSO.

  95. Doc Jones Says:

    I think that FTF has made a great point——-Now he knows who the scrap are and also who are true Brothers. It’s sad to see a club taken down by some weak ass bitches. Every club has issues from time to time. How many other clubs have been infiltrated? It is my sincere hope that the Mongols win the battle to keep their patch. This is a battle for all clubs. Who’s to say who the next club will be?

  96. To T Dogg Says:

    The post above saying “thank you, well said.” was meant TO you not meant to seem if it was FROM you. I don’t know how I dropped the “To” , but I apologize.

    Not Surprised

  97. THAT DUDE Says:

    HE WAS NOT THE NATIONAL PREZ AT THE TIME HE GOT BOOTED FROM THE CLUB PUNK ASS BITCH.

  98. To That Dude Says:

    I see. Thanks for correcting that. How should it be said then? Acting National President, LEGAL National President? Obviously no one took his colors after he was booted. Or am I wrong on this as well?

    Confusing. Maybe it was like that time in France when there were actually two Popes, both claiming to be th one true Pope. I cannot say.

    At any rate, my question was in fact, a question. Thanks for answering it.

  99. tinkadinka Says:

    t-dogg if your such a bad ass 1%er why are you on here shooting of your mouth…

    i agree with mooch i bet you would not meet him or any other mongol head up face to face..

    you say the mongols did not earn their patch well what do you call a 40 yr war with the 81 and they are still here…

    what i find so funny is how you ignorant people think this has only happen to the mongols..well it has happen to every major club that dears to wear a patch and not conform to government rule..

    so until you are man enough to name your club that you claim to belong to and meet up with the men you are calling bitches then you are nothing more than a cunt..

    and before you challenge me i am a woman….

  100. T-Dogg Says:

    Hey Mooch,

    You can claim to be able to refute everything I said but we know the truth.

    Bottom line is I still have my patch and proudly wear it eveyday wherever I want like any real patch-holder, you can’t do that anymore can you? Who’s the nobody now?

    I’m just sayin…

  101. Mooch Says:

    Does it feel good to fly that East Bay Dragons patch, or is it Magic Wheels? maybe Chosen Few?

    With a name like T-Dogg (evene the double g)
    I’m just sayin…

  102. JAMES Says:

    T-DOGG, sure is one DUMBFUCKER and another prime example of someone who talks shit and knows nothing about what he is talking about, get a life dummy,assfaces like you should not even be allowed to play on MOMMY and DADDYS computer.

  103. FTF Says:

    T-Dogg is a cop trying to start shit……

  104. Mooch Says:

    T-Dogg-
    I’m going to keep this real simple. Anyone who has ever earned a patch knows that its not the patch that makes the man. I know who I am and don’t need a patch to make me a somebody. I am a man, i stand on my own two feet. I am judged by my own actions, and respected by many for them.

    Whether of not you like me is of no concern to me. Whether or not you think people respect me or not is of no concern to me. The fact of the matter is I am a proud member of the Mongols MC and always will be. I don’t need to patch to know that. I don’t need a patch to know that I have always been there for my brothers and always will be. So your right, i do know the truth. And am very happy with it.

    Anyone can get on the internet and say they are a biker, judge other people, judge other clubs, and try and sound like a somebody. But don’t believe your own words and start thinking you are. You are like your screen name, you like to bark and hear the sound of your own voice.

    You can keep saying things like your a “real patch holder” and a “member of a major 1%er club” but you haven’t back any of that up. chances are it’s not true.

    You know who i am, I’m Mooch founder of the Oregon Mongols.
    You are “T-Dogg” member of a “major 1%er club”

    I don’t need your approval, and could careless about it.

    “you can’t do that anymore can you? Who’s the nobody now?”
    Google search my name right quick. Patch or no patch people know who I am.

    Try googling T-Dogg, and see what comes up other than rap songs.

  105. ROMPER STOMPER Says:

    T-DOGG OR T-BITCH WHICH ON IS TUFF GUY U KNOW DAM WELL U HAVE NO HUEVOS TELLING ANY MONGOL TO HIS FACE WHAT YOUR TYPING ON HERE I CAN SAY IM FROM ONE OF THE BIG 1%ER CLUBS IN THE WORLD BUT IM NOT AND YOU KNOW DAM WELL U AINT YOURSELF… SMELLS LIKE BACON TRYING TO STIR SHIT UP FUCKEN PUNK GROW SOME AND PUT WHATEVER CLUB YOUR FROM TUFF GUY CAUSE THEY MITE END UP PUTTING YOU IN CHECK….. “SUPPORT THE BLACK & WHITE NATION”

  106. Doc Jones Says:

    Hey T-DOGG,
    You have sparked a few responses haven’t you? Mooch stated who he is, the club he’s in and where it’s located. Even with all the problems the Mongols are having these days Mooch is standing tall!! How about you? Maybe it’s time for you to stand up like Mooch. You’ve been called a cop and a bitch. I don’t know any true outlaws who would allow that. If you are who you say you are, stand up for you and your club. If not, keep running your mouth so the rest of us can have a good laugh!!

  107. Old Timer Says:

    So I’ve found it really intersting to follow this dialogue and read everyone opinions but after reading some of the comments posted in the last two days, I had to put in my two cents.

    I am a proud 1%er. I earned my patch over 42 years ago and have worked very hard to keep it every day since. Seeing a club that has been around the club world almost as long as I have on the verge of extinction, forced me to pay attention because just like a lot of other folks I was thinking “Oh shit, we could be next!” I did my reasearch on this issue, which has included constantly staying up to date on all of the unsealed case filing in the Mongols RICO, reviewing past RICO cases involving MC and their members and speaking with criminal, business and trademark attorney’s in a hopes that we could protect ourselves from the government when and if they tried to pull the same shit with us. That said, I know a little about this and here is what I have to say.

    First off, there is no dispute that Doc as well as many other Mongols are no good piece of shit rats and they have admitted guilt and started to provide information on anything and everything they can think of that the feds are interested in. So there WILL be more indictments coming and some may not even be associated with the current Mongols RICO.

    Who does Doc have dirt on and how damaging will Doc be is the question? Without a doubt Doc can provide information that could possibly lead to RICO and conspiracy to commit extortion charges against members and associates of La EME. Beyond that Doc or his vatos had dealings with numerous other major 1% clubs across the USA and who knows what who they may drag into this just to make sure they dont do any hard time.

    Second, this is not a first ammendmant issue as a lot of people thought, it’s all about RICO and the associated criminal forfeiture statutes designed to help the government dismantle them. RICO was originaly designed to help target the mafia and is now used against many different types of criminal organizations and alleged criminal organizations and their members. The criminal forfeiture laws associated with RICO are designed to allow broad forfeiture of assets associated with the criminal enterprise. A nexus must be drawn etablishing the relationship between the defendant, the enterprise and the asset but the forfeiture laws are so broad it is very easy for the feds to do. In the Mongols case it was really easy for the feds to establish the nexus because Doc and several of the other rats plead guilty to Count 1 of the indictment, RICO.

    In the governments application for the forfetirue of the trademark they establish the nexus stating:

    “Here, defendant (and numerous others) have pled guilty to
    Count One of the Indictment. Defendant has admitted as part of
    his plea (and the undisputed evidence conclusively confirms) that
    the Mongols Registered Trademarks were acquired and maintained by
    defendant during and in the course of the operation of the RICO
    enterprise described in the Indictment, rendering them subject to
    forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 1963(a)(1). His admissions
    also establish that the Mongols Registered Trademarks afforded a
    source of influence over the RICO enterprise that defendant
    admits he established, operated, controlled, conducted and
    participated in the conduct of, rendering the marks subject to
    forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. § 1963(a)(2) as well. The 3
    Case 2:08-cr-01201-FMC Document 2124 Filed 06/29/2009 Page 8 of 13
    nexus requirement of Rule 32.2(b) having been satisfied, the
    proposed Preliminary Order should be entered.”

    Real simple, the feds will get the trademark because Doc and several other Mongols by pleading guilty to count 1 of the indictment have admitted that the Mongols are a criminal organization and Doc directed members to commit murder, assault, narcotics trafficing, extortion, blah blah blah. Further Doc has admitted that he obtained the trademark and used the logo to further the RICO (Mongols MC).

    The first ammendment argument that the Martin Guevara and the Mongols make in their most recent filings in this case with regards to the trademark are frivelous and will not hold water because Doc has admitted that he used the trademark (logo) to further the enterprise and the trademarks afforded a source of influence over the enterprise. Essentially this renders the Mongols logo a criminal tool which would not allow for first ammendment protection.

    While the Mongols and their pres Martin Guevara tried some creative moves to tranfer the trademark to various entity’s after the injuction was issued, it appears to have been done from a civil standpoint and the attorney handling the matter failed to factor in RICO and all the associated forfeiture laws. The government has used these recent filings by Mongol Nation (unicorporated association) to solidify their position that the Mongols MC has no rights to the trademark. The feds state:

    “The contemptuous act of transferring and assigning the 5
    registered marks to Mongols, Inc. in the face of this Court’s
    order prohibiting it arguably makes the transfer/assignment
    voidable by the Court, but the government is unlikely to request
    such a remedy since the transfer (1) deprives the unincorporated
    association of standing to make an ancillary claim, since it
    voluntarily assigned its entire interest in the marks to Mongols,
    Inc., and is therefore estopped from making an ownership claim in
    the ancillary proceeding; and (2) almost certainly makes it
    impossible as a matter of law for Mongols, Inc. to prevail in an
    ancillary proceeding on an innocent owner claim.”

    That said, the governments arguement is that Mongols Inc. is the only entity with right to an ancillary hearing regarding the trademark but due to these overly broad forfeiture laws, the feds can forfeit the trademark prior to any ancillary hearing, so it’s game on for the Fed’s.

    Now Mooch. You know what man, you can communicate well and I respect that, because that skill has and will serve you well in our world. Beyond that man, open your eyes. I googled your name like you suggested and didnt find anything that impressed me. So you and a few of your “homies” chased a couple of cops who were doing surveillance on you. Big fucking deal. What I can’t figure out is how you got off with such a light sentence. 1 day in jail for chasing a cop down the freeway then you violate your probation by moving to Cali and no real repercussions from the prob vio and it sounds offly suspicious to me. Hey remember that time that faggot Dobyns and his cop friends staged a Mongol murder to gain credability with the Angels. A car chase is far easier to stage.

    Either way, I applaud your loyalty to the Mongols, if it is genuine I commend you for it is one of the many traits that makes a true 1%er. Beyond that man, you have your shit mixed up because you aren’t a true 1%er no matter how many times to tattoo it on yourself and I base my opinion of the statements you have made in this forum:

    “The fact of the matter is I am a proud member of the Mongols MC and always will be. I don’t need to patch to know that. I don’t need a patch to know that I have always been there for my brothers and always will be.” (From Mooch’s post to T-Dogg)

    How rediculous is it for you to claim you’re a biker/1%er when you make statements abount not needing a patch. I’m a 1%er, my patch is the flag of my nation and our brotherhood and a tribute to all those men who died to establis and make my nation strong. Without my patch I am represent just me, a bad-ass mofo who loves to ride. Why do you think so many clubs had their patches forcibly pulled by other clubs back in the day? It wasn’t because they couldn’t remember who they were without their patches, it was because the patch is the flag and a nation without the ability to fly their flag is nothing. So don’t try and claim to be a 1%er and at the same time say that you don’t need your patch because you DO need you patch to be recognized as a legitimate MC. This is exactly the reason the feds have worked so hard to PULL YOURS. Mooch, you’ve had brothers that DIED for that patch and you say “you don’t need a patch”, how fucking disrespectful!

    For you to come down on T-Dogg for calling it like it is shows that you are not a 1%er. Maybe dropping yourname wasn’t that cool, but like you said yourself “google my name” all that info he dropped about you I as able to find via google, so don’t get your panties is a wad just because the truth hurts.

    Back in the 70′s and early 80′s the Mongols MC was a respectable club, whether I got along with the club or not, I have known some very respectable Mongols over the years, including some of their more recent members that came in from other outlaw clubs. The Mongols MC of today has evolved to be something far different from their roots.

    No prospecting required, no bike required, recuiting gangbangers,toss your colors in the garbage at Laughlin, it’s ok to rat, the former National Pres says their a criminal organization and the Oregon founder says he doesn’t need colors. What in the fuck about that combo makes the Mongols an MC???

    Like I said, there are still a few real 1%ers left in the Mongols and their numbers are few and far between. To those I commend you for staying true to yourselves, I hope you weather the storm and are able to find a true MC to provide you with the brotherhood, loyalty, honor and respect our life is really about.

    Like I said before, I have been part of the club world for over 40 years and during that time I have seen it change dramatically. Fortunately most of the changes I have seen in the outlaw clubs have been good. The cops have even gotten better. Yeah they are still a major pain in the ass and that fucking midget Ciccone is a crazy zelot waging his own personal jihad against bikers but at least the cops arn’t using a traffic stop to give you some flashlight therapy and all the other fun stuff we had to endure over the years. The current incarnation of the Mongols has only served to hurt the entire club community but one good lesson the Mongols have taught us is this:

    If your club behave like a criminal gang, the feds WILL pull your patch! If you behave like a real MC, you have nothing to fear but the BS and drama you are currently getting.

    If you are lucky enough to currently be a member of a rightious MC, don’t be complaicant. work within your individual club communities and nationally to fight the anti-gang legislation that is unfairly applied to MC’s so that you and your culture can still be flourishing 50 years from now.

    Old Timer 1%er

  108. Old Timer Says:

    By the way, I wanted to say this as well for people like Romper Stomper that have been saying that people should post which club they are from. GROW UP YOU KNOW NOTHING BITCHES!!!

    This is an open forum for people to share their personal opinions. It would be irresponsible and straight up wrong for any club member to discuss their club affiliation associated with their personal opinion here since it is highly doubtful that the members club has authorized them to speak on behalf of the club in this forum. In any real 1% club, speaking on behalf of the club when you are not authorized is a quick ticket to an eye dotting!

    So for all you no nothing wannabee’s that think someone has no balls, or is full of shit about being a 1%er because they don’t state what club they are from , you are just demonstrating to us all that you are exaclty what I just said you were “Know nothing bitches!”

    Old Timer 1%er

  109. tinkadinka Says:

    Hey Moouch, it’s Country’s ol’lady-Tink. Just wanted to say it was great meeting you this past weekend. And i don’t care what anyone says or thinks. The Mongols MC is the best group of brothers and family anyone could hope to be a part of. All this shit happening now will make the true brothers stronger and more devoted in the end.
    As a very wise man said once “it’s not the patch that makes the man, it’s the man that makes the patch”—your brother and my soul mate Country.
    L & R
    Tink

  110. tinkadinka Says:

    To Moouch.
    Sorry, but i beleive i had you confused w/ someone else when posting my previous comment.
    L & R
    Tink

  111. Mooch Says:

    To Tinkadinka-
    Your right you had me confused with my twin brother, but thank you for your support.

    To everyone-
    this is my last post on here because i feel embarrassed that i even got wrapped up in internet drama.

    To Old Timer-
    First of all I wasn’t bragging about who I am. My point was that I am not a nobody as T-Dogg implied. I was not trying to brag about my case.

    Second, I did not mean that I don’t ever need a patch. I said I was a proud member of the Mongols MC, that would include flying the patch. However when T-dogg tried to make me sound like less of a club member because i currently didn’t have it I was trying to point out the fact that I am still a proud Mongol, and still a 1%er even if at the moment I can’t wear my patch. I am on a very strict probation, and am not allowed to wear it even if the injunction wasn’t in place right now.

    What I was arguing with T-Dogg about was the fact that he said the Oregon Mongols posed for some pictures and went into hiding, that is absolutely not true. That is what upset me.

    And last to clear this up, and there are plenty of court records to prove it.
    1) All i did was follow some under cover investigators that instigated me into a chase. I did not run them off the road, or do any damage to their vehicle etc.
    2) I was facing some very heavy charges. However they were fabricated by the police and media, for nothing illegal had occurred.
    3) I did not take a plea bargain or any sort of deal, I took my case to a jury trial and spent a week fighting for my freedom. Hardly something a snitch would do. I was found not guilty off all felony charges by a jury. but found guilty of a few misdemeanor charges.
    4) while fighting my case I was held on a one million dollar bail, and was in jail for 64 days. I was sentenced to one year for the misdemeanors and served 1 day after my sentencing but did 64 days total. Lane Co. Jail is under budgeted and under staffed and they have been kicking out less violent offenders to make room for more violent offenders. I served another month on the road crew in lieu of my remaining 91/2 months i had to do. So I did a lot more than one day. I was over charged for what essentially where traffic violations. I was used as a media pawn to get attention to the voters about the dire budget problems in Lane Co.
    5) I was placed on 5 years extensive gang probation and non association. when i violated my probation, i as brought up on a revoke hearing. which means if they felt what i did was such a bad crime they would of taken me off probation and put me back in jail for 6 months and i would of come out off paper. The judge, DA and local LEO wanted to make sure I stayed on NA so they did not revoke my probation. It was political games.

    I have never snitched on anyone in my entire life. and before anyone starts trying to put a snitch jacket on someone please check the paper work. Old Timer you seem to be intelligent enough to check into the Black Rain so nothing should stop you from verifying my case.

    Ok, that’s it for me on here fellas.
    take care

  112. Mooch Says:

    A few things a forgot…

    I don’t know of any under-covers that ever had their club name tattooed hella big on the back of their heads like I do. All the pix of the Mongols MC head tattoo that are all over the internet are my head.

    Also I am on 5 years of supervised probation with Non association with not only the Mongols but any motorcycle club or street gang. It actually says any club what so ever. so i guess my friends in the ELKS can’t see me either. so the theory that i would be gathering Intel or building a case on anyone would be pretty hard when I’m not allowed to see anyone.

    Lastly, i feel i have had some good conversation on here with a few intelligent people. So Sohn or Old Timer if you ever feel the need to continue conversation feel free to get my private email address from Rebel.

    promise that’s it from me.
    everyone take care and watch out for the real gang members…the ones in blue.

  113. JAMES Says:

    I as one who is in a 1% CLUB hold my patch as in the highest regard and would protect it at all costs, and it shows where my loyalties lie and whom I am a member of, if I decide not wear it , that is my business because I know who I am and as it was stated THE PATCH DOES NOT MAKE THE MAN, THE MAN MAKES THE PATCH.I believe the statements by MOOCH were misinterpreted, and the OLD TIMER needed to read a little closer before forming his opinion(which he is intitled to).

  114. Doc Jones Says:

    In my humble opinion—-RIGHT FUCKING ON JAMES!! I’d also like to add that each club has thier own way of doing things. If the Mongols allow members who don’t ride bikes, well, that’s the way they decide to do things. It’s up to each individual club to decide how their club will operate. It doesn’t mean that you have to agree with how they conduct themselves. Actually it’s none of anyones business except the members themselves. I’m not claiming to know how the Mongols operate because I’m not a member. I do know that many people hate the Mongols and yet they go wherever they choose and from what I can tell they answer to nobody except themselves. The deal about putting their cuts in a trash can at Laughlin, maybe the one’s who did that wanted to escape getting caught and later sent a prospect or hang around back to retrive them. Perhaps the one’s who did that are three strikers and that was their only way to escape. I’m not saying it’s right or wrong. That’s up to the club to decide. Another thing, when you state your opinion on a site like this you open yourself up to being called names and whatever. That’s just the way it is. I’m not claiming to be a 1%er or a “Tuff Guy”. I’m only stating my thoughts.

  115. Sohn Says:

    To Doc Jones
    I agree, how a club operates is their business. That’s why not every club is right for everyone-get in where you fit in so to speak. I know my club doesn’t allow cops and rats, it’s one of the main things that drew me to it. I know people that are in clubs with cops, girls, black people and sport bikes though and they’re still all right people. But the main thing about an MC is fucking MOTORCYCLES; It’s why it’s called a motorcycle club! If you don’t require people to have and ride motorcycles call your club something else. There’s nothing wrong with car clubs, glee clubs, gun clubs, social clubs or whatever. Although personally, I think the Mongols do require a bike or at least to get one within a prescribed time. But, if they don’t, they should not have an MC on their patch or any other motorcycle club that doesn’t require people to ride bikes for that matter. And if you follow “World Wide” news, motorcycle clubs with members that don’t ride motorcycles seems to be a common complaint in the biker or bikie community and it should be. I’m not trying to be a “tuff guy” either; I’m just stating my thoughts and the thought and logic that seem to have some sort of universal appeal.

  116. wolf Says:

    Old Timer,

    I just wanted to say thanks for the real wisdom! It is interesting to see how far off some of the youngsters can be with their idea of what it means to be a real 1%er. They have an idea and they know lots of slogans like “it’s not the patch that makes he man”, but it is clear that they have not truly learned what they need to know. The younger generation is essential to the survival of the club community but they need guys like you and Sohn to show them the true path. Thanks for all your work, I wish there were mrs brothers like you.

    L/H/R,

    Wolf

  117. Doc Jones Says:

    Hey Sohn,
    I have to say that I would never belong to a MC That didn’t mandate it’s members to own an American made motorcycle of at least 1000cc. It makes sense that a MC be what it claims to be. However, some clubs might not think like you and I do. These days things are so different than they used to be. I remember when runs were a lot different. There were turnout tents, lot’s of firearms, explosives and if you got caught sleeping you may very well wake up painted. It was wild!! Now the runs are really mellow. It’s a sign of the times. With all the new laws you can’t do things like you could in the past. Hell, now you have to wear a stinking helmet. You can’t even hang a rope from your handlebar without it being called a weapon and be charged with a felony. I’ve even heard that there’s a law prohibiting a club to have prospects. I don’t know if that is correct information but it wouldn’t surprise me. The other thing I’ve noticed is everyone seems to be riding baggers and all the new bikes have electric starters. I remember saying that I would never own an electric starter. I would strip down my pan or shovel to the bare bones and not even have saddlebags. Now my son has a panhead that I gave him and I have a fatboy. My old lady has a duce. We rode to Sturgis last summer and it felt like we were riding on a pillow. What a change from the old wishbone or straight leg. Right now I’m dealing with a shoulder injury and I think I have too much time on my hands. I guess I’m using this site to reminisce about the past. I really enjoy reading all the posts and hearing the different views. I wonder where things will be ten years from now!! I’m done babbling.

  118. JAMES Says:

    I am 28YR. MEMBER of the CLUB I belong to and damned proud of it, I may not agree with alot of decisions made or some of the goings on, but I can and will express myself and form my own opinions as to what is going on.If I choose to wear my PATCH or NOT TO when ever I go out my front door it is my decision to do so, as I know who I am and so do most of the people around, I believe in the rulings of owning and riding motorcycles as that is what the M.C. stands for, I for one do care about the CLUB I belong to and keeping with it’s traditions, andI also do say, HTE PACTH DOES NOT MAKE THE MAN, I am no youngster.

  119. BEANER Says:

    U DONT NEED TO WEAR A PATCH TO THINK U R A BADASS, ME AND MY BROTHERS KNOW WHERE WE STAND WITH EACH OTHER… THATS WHAT BROTHERHOOD IS ALL ABOUT… HOOAH!!!

  120. 1%ER Says:

    WELL FIRST I WOULD LIKE TO SAY IT IS AWESOME TO READ THE COMMENTS ON THIS SITE..

    I AM A 3RD GENERATION BIKER I GREW UP AROUND MY FATHERS AND UNCLES CLUB..

    THERE WAS A COMMENT MADE THAT A TRUE BROTHERHOOD WOULD NOT ALLOW THEM SELVES TO BE TAKEN BY COPS..WELL IF HISTORY AND MEMORY SERVES ME RIGHT..

    EVERY MAJOR CLUB HAS HAD UNDER COVERS IN IT..

    YES THE MONGOLS HAD BILLY QUEEN,AND NOW CICCONE

    THE HELLS ANGELS HAD RAY DOBYENS AND IN THE SEVENTIES IT SEEMED LIKE THE ENTIRE GOVERNMENT..

    THE WARLOCKS HAD AN ENTIRE CHAPTER THAT WERE FEDS JUST TO NAME A FEW

    MY POINT IS THAT DOSE NOT MAKE THEM ANY LESS THAN A BROTHERHOOD…

    THE FEDS HAVE HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS TO CREATE ANY PERSONALITY THAT THEY NEED TO TO GET THEM IN A CLUB ALL THE BACKGROUND CHECKS AND PRIVATE INVESTIGATORS IN THE WORLD COULDN’T FIND OUT THE TRUTH..

    I ALSO AGREE WITH THE PERSPECTIVE OF OLD TIMER AND JAMES…GOOD JOB GENTLEMEN..THAT IS ALL I WANTED TO SAY..THANK YOU FOR ALLOWING ME TO VOICE MY OPINION…GOOD LUCK TO THE MONGOLS BUT MORE SO GOOD LUCK TO THIS COUNTRY CAUSE IF THIS HAPPENS THEN WE ARE ALL FUCKED NO MATTER WHAT COLOR YOU OR PATCH YOU WEAR

    RESPECT TO ALL
    1%ER

  121. Also To Mooch Says:

    88 MOOCH MY WHITE BROTHER WE NEED TO KEEP THE NIGGERS OFF THE STREETS A NIGGER SHOULDNT EVEN BE ALLOW TO RIDE AMERICAN BIKES YOU HAVE THE BALLS TO CALL A NIGGER A NIGGER RIGHT ON WHITE BROTHER FUCK NIGGERS 88/14

  122. DirtyBruin Says:

    There’s only one race: it’s called HUMAN. And yes, the people you’re throwing the word “nigger” at are indeed human. Just like me, just like you, whether you like it or not.

    To borrow a phrase from William Shatner – “GET A LIFE!”

  123. John Cokos Says:

    James may well be a man of rare intellect, a Muse of sorts. He (“get’s it”)! Keep posting the pearls, the swine may just wake up !

  124. JAMES Says:

    The MONGOLS will win the case as TO , OWNING THE PATCH, and TO STILL BEING ABLE TO WEAR IT, DOC has already been prooved to not be the owner of the MONGOLS M.C. and PATCH, and further more THE CENTER PATCH WAS NEVER A PART OF THE INDICTMENT OR ORDER, only THE TOP ROCKER, FEDS tried to file on THE CENTER after the fact, so all news articles claiming the CENTER PATCH was included were wrong. The MONGOLS M.C. have a great chance at winning all these items, getting their PROPERTY BACK, and continuing to be THE MONGOLS M.C AS IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN WITHOUT DOC AND HIS SELECT FEW.

  125. JAMES Says:

    OH WELL, I AM RIGHT AT TIMES AND LOOKS LIKE I WAS RIGHT THIS TIME, HELL OF A DAEL.

  126. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    MONGOLS ALREADY WON THE COURT CASE , JUDGE PISSED AT THE FEDS . MONGOLS PRINTING UP NEW WEARS ALREADY . MFFM

    RESPECT STEVE

  127. BDOPC Says:

    I went 3/4 of the way through the statements made by the commentators and it all made me sick. Sonny Barger in his first book said that his club would never take members from the other Big 3 clubs and yet what happened? Look at Phila. or Balt.? The P’s went looking for what really belonged to them and they were aressted and yet they did’nt snivel. Yeah; Sonny , what am I supposed to believe next? You lied or your club changed policy. I’ve been around since 1964 on the East Coast and I,ve seen all the changes over the years.Remember your buddy Sandy? So when all your supporters cry and snivel how your patch was so wronged ,remember this,when you Lie you will always be found out for what you really are.Tell the truth !!!

  128. M. Malone Says:

    Who cares if the mongols won their case. They are still in a world of trouble with the Feds breathing down their necks and even worse, with the Hells Angels still looking for mass payback for the cowardly killing of Mark “Papa” Guardado. My guess is the Angels will get themselves a Mongols CP scalp before long and all the Mongols will be able to do is wet their little panties about it and then lose some more club houses to the Angels:)

  129. FTF Says:

    M. Malone,

    You are talking out of your neck buddy….It’s people like you who fuel the fire of a war that’s gone on too long. You are an idiot, and probably a cop. FUCK OFF

  130. Another Outlaw Biker Says:

    Another long list of people posting and as usual no one here seems to know what there talking about….but everyone has lots to say right

    let me break it down for ya people…..I knew DOC personally he was a jack ass when I first met him in 2007 in Nevada and guess what he’s still a jack ass & now and he can ad RAT clown to his list of flaws

    Although the Mongols may have won there recent case to legaly wear there colours and retrieve there property “Stolen by the feds” this is only a drop in an ocean of the missery and pain they can look forward to in there very bleak future

    they may have won the battle but they wont win the war!

    dont get me wrong people im not on the side of the feds nor am I against the mongols im an outlaw biker myself and part of one of the magor clubs but im a realist and when a club like the mongols grows has fast as they have and has violent as they are (recruiting street hoods) that know as much about the biker life as I know about gardening its just a matter of time …..I would bet old John Gotti thought he was going to walk away to after he won a few cases against the federal goverment THE MONGOLS HAVE PLACED TO MUCH OF A TARGET ON THERE BACKS AND ME AND ALL THE MY BROTHERS ARE TAKING BETS ON JUST WHEN AND WHERE THE GOVERMENT MAKE THERE FINAL KILL SHOT……sorry to the boys in the Mongols its a sad reallity but its one you brought down on yourselves

    C.

    Just another outlaw wondering where the old days went

  131. Jake D Says:

    You Sound like an HA to me buddy the Mongols rule your wrong they will never die

  132. Sammy Says:

    Your wright The mongols are done I dont think your an angel but I think you have a grip on reality and its refreshing from the rest of these guys posting who are obviously mongols themselves or wannabe punks

  133. JAMES Says:

    THE MONGOLS M.C. WILL CONTINUE TO SURVIVE, AND YES MAYBE A BIT MORE PROBLEMS WILL BE ARRISING, BUT I BELIEVE THEY WILL LAST JUST AS LONG AS ANY OF THE OTHERS,TIMES ARE CHANGING FOR ALL CLUBS AND IF ANYONE THINKS FOR ONE MINUTE THEY CAN SAY GOODBYE TO THE MONGOLS, AND THINK THEY ARE NOT GOING TO BE NEXT IS WRONG.OR PERHAPS ANOTHER CLUB WILL GO FIRST, ONE NEVER KNOWS,I FOR ONE WILL BE ON THE SIDE OF THE CLUBS NO MATTER WHAT PATCH YOU FLY,JUST AS I WILL GO TO THE AID OF ANOTHER PACTCH AGAINST CITIZENS REGARDLESS OF THE DIFFERENCES I MAY HAVE WITH THEM, WE WILL SETLLE OURS LATER IF NEED BE.

  134. Rebel Says:

    Dear Another Outlaw Biker,

    Motherfucker please. You know I can tell who you are, right? Listen, while I am talking to you, I am thinking about doing another piece on the show. Can you get me onto the set in Tujunga? I promise I will behave.

    Now, as far as the real world goes, the title of this case is the “United States versus Cavazos and others.” The ATF and the DOJ have tried to portray this as the “United States versus the Mongols.” Judge Cooper has already ruled that that shit will not fly. Okay?

    Doc Cavazos is a narcissist. He seized control of a motorcycle club and enlisted allies into the club who reinforced his narcissism. Motorcycle clubs are always heroically democratic, egalitarian and anti-materialistic. Clubs are about the brotherhood. That is the Achilles heel the Feds always exploit in these investigations. One brother, who happens to be an undercover agent, convinces another brother to break the law on videotape.

    The slam dunk part of this case has always been Doc Cavazos and what Doc can convince a jury to believe. To call the recent ATF harassment of the myriad individual Mongols, “…only a drop in an ocean of the misery and pain they can look forward to in their very bleak future” is just inaccurate. The Mongols Motorcycle Club is actually winning its part of this case.

    You are talking about the Mongols versus the ATF, right? As far as club politics goes and all the many enemies Doc went out of his way to make, well that is a different story. Personally, I hope everybody gets their respect. On that part of the Mongols’ future, I am Switzerland.

    And, if you are not actually who I think you are I apologize for my rude and abrupt tone. All due respect. No offense intended. Son of Anarchy Forever Forever Sons of Anarchy. Okay?

    Your Pal,
    Rebel

  135. THE REAPER Says:

    AHHH THE OLD DAYS.. STOP LIVING IN THE PAST SHIT HAS CHANGED CLUBS HAVE CHANGED.. THERE WELL ALWAYS BE RATS & UNDERCOVERS IN CLUBS SHIT WELL NEVER CHANGE MONGOLS DID NOT JUST WIN THEY ONE FOR ALL CLUBS ANYONE CAN BE A TUFF GUY ON THE NET.. YOU KNEW DOC PERSONALLY AND HE WAS A JACKASS DID YOU TELL HIM THAT TO HIS FACE OR WERE U ON YOUR KNESS SUCKING HIS COCK BUYING HIM A BEER PLEASE.

  136. Mike Says:

    Has anybody thought that the feds might have sealed some papers, and made some deals just to make it look as Doc and the others turned? This helps on the rest of their cases which are all outstanding. Psych warfare at its best. Turn them against each other.

  137. THE SELFISH ONE Says:

    ALTHOU IM SURE ILL PAY A FINE AND SURLY PROSPECT FOR WHAT IM ABOUT TO WRITE. I HAVE TO GIVE YOU MY SIDE OF THIS. WHILE I AM A MEMBER OF THE MONGOLS, A PROUD ONE AT THAT. YOU GUY’S HAVE TO KNOW THAT A LOT OF BROTHERS DID STAND UP TO THAT PIECE OF SHIT AND HIS CRONIES. A LOT OF GOOD BROTHERS WALKED AWAY FROM THE CLUB, SOME WERE KICKED OUT. ANY OF YOU WHO HAVE EVER BEEN IN A CLUB KNOW HOW HARD IT IS TO WALK AWAY FROM SOMETHING THAT YOU DEDICATED YOUR LIFE TO. SOME KNOW BROTHERS THAT DID WALK AWAY FOR ONE REASON OR ANOTHER AND SAW HOW PAINFULL IT WAS FOR THEM. MANY OF YOU WHO HAVE BEEN IN A CLUB, AND THAT’S WHO IM TALKING TO CAUSE FOR THE MOST PART IF YOU HAVENT WALKED IN OUR SHOES YOUR OPINION DOESN’T COUNT. MANY SAY THAT IF THAT WOULD HAVE HAPPENED TO US YOU WOULD HAVE DONE THIS, SAID THAT. THING IS IT DIDN’T HAPPEN TO YOU, IT HAPPENED TO US. WERE THE ONE’S THAT ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT HAPPENED TO US, WERE THE ONE’S FEELING THE HEAT. THIS IS NOT OVER BY ANY MEANS. WE STILL HAVE A LONG WAY TO GO. BUT I GOTTA SAY I IF I HAD TO GO TO WAR ID DO IT AGAIN WITH THIS GROUP. AM PROUD TO BELONG TO THIS BUNCH OF OUTLAWS. A FEW BROTHERS STEPPED UP AND TOOK CONTROL OF THE CLUB AFTER THE RAIDS. THOSE BROTHERS HAVE TO BE COMENDED FOR WHAT THE’VE DONE,. THEY COULD HAVE LET THE CLUB JUST DISAPEAR, JUST BE A MEMORY, BUT DIDN’T, THOSE BROTHERS HAD THE BALLS TO STICK THERE NECKS OUT. THEY DIDN’T LET THE FEDS TAKE AWAY WHAT WAS RIGHTFULLY OURS AND HANDED DOWN TO US BY 8 OF THE BADDEST MOTHER FUCKERS WEARING A MONGOL VEST. ’WHO THE FUCK ARE WE” THOSE FIRST FEW HAD THE BALLS TO SAY FUCK YOU, WERE WEARING IT! TO THOSE AND THE BROTHERS WHO KEPT IT GOING AND STILL GOING YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE, NEXT ROUNDS ON ME BROTHERS. IM NOT HERE TO HAVE A FIGHT CLUB ON LINE AND BOX WITH ANYONE, YOU GUYS HAVE THE RIGHT TO SAY WHAT YOU WANT, AT LEAST THAT’S WHAT I WAS TOLD WHEN I SERVED THIS FUCKING COUNTRY FOR 12 YEARS. NOT ONLY DID I THINK I WAS FIGHTING FOR MY RIGHTS AND FREEDOM AS WELL AS YOURS, BUT THE RIGHT TO WEAR WHAT EVER I FUCKING WANTED. WHERE ARE WE WHEN THE FEDS THINK THEY CAN TELL US WHAT WE CAN AND CANT WEAR, ID LOVE TO TELL MY OL LADY NOT TO WEAR A BRA FROM NOW ON. BUT THAT SHIT AINT GONA FLY. MY POINT IS THIS AINT 1939 GERMANY, OR 1941 LOS ANGELES (ZOOT SUITERS) WE HAVE A LONG FIGHT STIIL AHEAD OF US BROTHERS, LIKE I SAID THIS AINT OVER BY ANY MEANS. YOU HEAR FROM TIME TO TIME “DON’T BELIVE WHAT YOU HEAR OR READ” IN CAVASOS CASE PLEASE DO AS YOUR TOLD. I KNEW HIM AND HIS BROTHER WHEN I WAS A KID BACK IN THE EARLY SEVENTIES, HE WAS A PIECE OF SHIT THEN AND IT CARRIED OVER TO HIS ADULTHOOD. ANY CHANCE HE AND HIS BROTHER HAD TO GET OVER ON YOU THEY DID AND WOULD, WELL NOTHING CHANGED. WE LOST A LOT OF GOOD BROTHERS, BUT DON’T THINK WE LOST ALL OF THEM BECAUSE OF HIM. WHEN HE WAS KICKED OUT WE WERE HEADED IN A GOOD DIRECTION. OUR LEADERSHIP START GETTING RID OF THE GUY’S WHO KNEW NOTHING OF BROTHERHOOD, DIDN’T RIDE A BIKE. WE STARTED CLEANING UP THE CLUB WHEN WE WERE HIT IN THE RAIDS. WE STILL HAVE GREAT LEADERSHIP, THOSE ARE THE BROTHERS THAT DIDN’T GIVE UP, KEPT TELLING US NOT TO GIVE UP, STARTED HOLDING FUNDRAISERS FOR OUR DEFENCE. THOSE GUY’S ARE REAL BROTHERS. WE ARE MONGOLS 2009. NOTHINGS CHANGED. TO THOSE OF YOU THAT WEAR A 1% PATCH, WHAT EVER PATCH YOU CHOOSE TO WEAR. GIVE IT UP TO THE FEW MONGOLS THAT STAYED THE COURSE, DIDN’T STRAY AWAY. THOSE BROTHERS BELIVE IT OR NOT HELPED SAVE NOT ONLY MY PATCH BUT MAYBE YOURS AS WELL. SO HERE’S TO YOU BROTHERS LIL”D”, CHEVY CHASE, DA’NERO, RIGHTY, EAGLE. IM SURE I LEFT OUT A FEW BUT THAT JUST MIGHT CUT DOWN ON ME DIS PROSPECTING FOR TO LONG. AGAIN HERE’S TO YOU BROTHERS.
    “WHO THE FUCK ARE WE? MONGOLS M.C.

    THE SELFISH ONE
    BOYLE HEIGHTS
    MONGOLS MOTORCYCLE CLUB
    MFFM.

  138. JAMES Says:

    SELFISH ONE, BRO u told it like it is, and I for one personally know also as I am one of you also, yes it was hard for those BROTHERS to walk away rather than to do what one of our CARDINAL RULES are not to fight or to kill our own, it takes more to do what those older BRO’S did than anyone could imagine, it took a lot to get this back on track, and you are also correct on getting rid of the non-biker types, things are changing amd for much better days for the MONGOLS M.C., it’ hard to tell people what is going on behind the scenes but we know and we know who we are and we damned sure aren’t going away, MONGOLS FOREVER FOREVER MONGOLS M.C., HUAH!

  139. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    mongols maybe moving to fast , prospects coming out of every small town.
    respect,steve

  140. sp Says:

    We shoulda stopped these ATF cowboys after Ruby Ridge and Waco.
    Soon it wont matter, they want a war with the free minded and they will make it happen.

  141. izapmtb Says:

    i agree with anonymous, ‘government loses’ idiot’s they can wear thier patch,s’so think before you write t-dogg, and others that wish they were a ‘mongol’ u write crap because your at home do it in front of them’ lol’ that will never happen, show me the papers that ‘doc’ rated how stupid u our to believe the ‘media’ united states attorney’ there so embarresed cuss they lost’ so they will make anything up to make them selves look good’ and they will use anyone ‘doc’ pleaded gilty cuss he was! there nothing that ‘doc’ can rat out everything has been said and done so anyone that gets arrested its not cuss of ‘doc’ its because there big mouth talking and telling what they did ‘take it to your grave’ dont ever confess and if you do dont blame anyone unless u see that person staring at you in court then you call him a ‘rat’ and about the eme thanks to ‘doc’ he fixed it up you dont even no what happen one of the bad apples riped them off for there drugs and money none of the other mongols new that that bad apple was not even suppose to be there and the reason he got busted by ‘doc’ was because someone got hurt and the eme was arrested because of that one bad apple and money and drugs were lost that night so of course there going after the mongols so ‘doc’ had to fix that little part up and the bad apple was out’bad. ‘and about goverment they hated that ‘doc’ was not a looser he had a good job, a nice house ‘respect’ not a druggie, made the club bigger, had a nice club house the mongols money was shown out in the open he did not have to steal it and the goverment was pissed becuase he was smart and they were getting scared even police officer partied at the club house, goverment dosent mention that huh.. and about billy i seen with my own eyes he was a happy mongol i think now billy wishes he was still a mongol and he should be right at ‘doc’ side for not helping the poor guys that got there ass kicked and hurt when him as an officer could of prevented that he took an oath and gave it up for the mongols, and let them people suffer that is teribble and very sad cuss those people really needed help. and of course mongols were out bad because they kept getting druged up and ‘doc’ did not like that. the goverment were so despeared they even harrased there x-wifes to go agaist the mongols or as there words ‘help us put the puzzle together’ that how bad they needed witnesses because billy mind was in la la land.so dont talk shit until you see that rat on the stand looking at you while your fighting your case and the ones that say the ‘mongols’ are gone open your eyes silly there all over. the one that should be in prison are the mr pigs, that steal and rape our kids and kill there family soul’s because they could not get a girl of there own age hey and they get probation so wake up USA and talk about those loosers..

  142. Taino871 Says:

    Rebel, I am not “Crapping on anything you have said, And I also wore a uniform For MY COUNTRY, But because Doc did in fact write and publish the book prior to the arrest, and so on. Those monies made are his, Anything AFTER the arrest is now property of the Government. So if for some Crazy Reason the book “Jumps” Back on to the shelves they can take it all! I must also add I do in fact stand by the Mongols for certain Family reasons it hurts me to the core to think a “RAT” led this Brotherhood into ruins. Just my 2 cents And no hard feelings intended to any and ALL patches. And I would never crap on the H.A. or any brother’s. Lets just live to ride and ride to live. Semper Fi.

  143. Rebel Says:

    Dear Taino871,

    Oh, no, you are hardly crapping on me.

    Yeah, nobody seems to have much good to say about Doc. He was kind of out there before the big bust. It always looked to me like Doc really wanted to be Sonny Barger.

    As far as I am concerned, and I am not HA but still, there is only one Sonny Barger like there is only one George Washington. That is not about whether you like the guy or his club or any of that. I think Barger is an historical figure. I think Barger is a genius at what he has accomplished and he came along at the right time in history. No Sonny Barger and this would be a different world. Two hundred years from now, anybody who takes a class in “20th Century America” will know who Sonny Barger was. I don’t know how they will judge him. I don’t know if history will call him a good guy or a bad guy. Napoleon once said, “You can’t make an omelette without breaking eggs.” Barger made a couple omelettes.

    Doc cavazos is more like a tragic figure. Maybe 200 years from now, some future Shakespeare will write a play about Doc. Maybe. If somebody does, I don’t know if Doc Cavazos will come across more like King Lear or PT Barnum. In the short term, he seems to have fucked up a perfectly good motorcycle club.

    The law says the government owns everything Doc owned. Doc pled guilty. Right now, the royalties from Doc’s book belong to the government.

    I don’t know, but I still think Doc has a chance to land on his feet and avoid tragedy. For all I know five years from now Doc will have another book out and have his own television reality series and be romantically linked to Sarah Palin. Maybe he will be an adviser to Sons of Anarchy. Maybe Kurt Sutter will mysteriously disappear and Doc will take his job.

    Argue with me anytime.

    your pal,
    Rebel

  144. THE SELFISH ONE Says:

    to izapmtb, unless your a real biker, a brother or a Mongol you need to get your facts staight buddy. you think that piece of shit did good by the club? for what happend with the EME? for what happend by him making the club bigger? really? were a biker club, not a gang we have no buisnese with the EME. nuff said. izapmtb dont belive what your ol lady told you bout my club. quantity instead of quality? really? huge mistake! do you know how many brothers, good brothers! walked out or got kicked out because they didnt agree with that jack ass for what he was doing bringing in guy’s that wernt bikers didnt have a bike? if you had any idea what he did to not just us but the 1%ers that are out there for doing that? for one it made your everyday Joe think that were just like the SOA. that all clubs are drug dealing, porn pimping gun running enterprises. is that what you do? i dont. rat or no rat i couldnt give a fuck, thing is we let it happen and now we have to police our selves. rat or no rat he’s not a brother, never was a biker. and you my be right Rebel he might just land on his feet after all this who know’s, to be honest who cares. just because your skinny ol lady looks better than my chubby one in shorts or naked, doesnt mean she know’s how to fuck better, or give a better blow job than mine, for all you brothers that have a chubby ol lady or ever slept with one you know what im talking about. nothing better than a chubby sex hungry chick that hasnt fucked in a while. my point is quality better than quantity. how many of those guy’s that dip shit brought in are still in? answer not many. those are the guy’s when shit got tuff dropped there shit. is that what kind of brother you want in your club just to make numbers? i dont. dont blind yourself by what you think he did or didnt do, fact is were in this mess because of not just him but others. we didnt help our cause. the Mongols were around long before dumb fuck and will continue to be around for along after. we have great leadership in place now. were going back to what a “REAL MOTORCYCLE CLUB” should be. anyway thanks Rebel for let me get on this soap box for a minute.

    THE SELFISH ONE
    BOYLE HEIGHTS CHAPTER
    MONGOLS MOTORCYCLE CLUB.
    MFFM.

  145. ONE BAD MAN Says:

    Much Love and respect too selfish one I liked everything you said I wish everyone would listen to the truth you spoke Jingles chapter 13 was my uncle never new it when I was In the club didnt find out till long time after Be safe and much respect

  146. Money love Says:

    He fucked up a good thing alright! I would be a Mongol today if it wasn’t for that Gang Bang Wanna Be biker! Didn’t even prospect? Where is the fucking honor in that?? I have an in too the Mongols and I STILL would have prospected to the fullest to gain my respect from my brother’s!! That is what happens when you try to be bigger than the game!!

  147. Money love Says:

    To the Selfish One, you are right on the money! My cousin ranked high in the Nevada Chapter for the Mongols (Vegas to be exact) and he was under Roger P. for the full time. He told me exactly the same thing that you are saying that happened. Roger (like a true warrior and leader that he is) was gunned down and survived in Laughlin and was fucking voted out without even being present in the elections?? Talk about a loop hole in Mongol Law!! Enter Doc, How the hell did this happen man?? If you can ever bring the club back up again, I hope that you guys reign bigger and stronger than ever before!!! I may even join you!

  148. bobby Says:

    It’s easy to tell the true 1% Club members from the ones that just don’t understand. Old member from late 60′s to 75(Not Mongol) The pretty picture doc painted was kind of like a nice dream. I live way up north now and some news travels slow. It was fucked to find out is was all a lie.Thats not to say this was not a Righteous Club, and I hope it can be again. I believe it can after reading the Member’s posts from the Heart. No Disrespect-I heard you guys got the Colors/Patch back-Hope its True. Respect Black and White

  149. Stoney Says:

    I bet the wished they would have listened to red dog now. he saw it all coming and tried to stop it but was over-ruled. O’well, ya pay the price for not listening to your brothers.

  150. bobby Says:

    I just checked out docs website respectfewfearnone.com and he has the tee shirts with club name and logo for sale and the big photo gallery. I would HAVE to think he would be SO ASHAMED. i dont think its balls-i dont think its nerve-I think its pathetic. How do you do that? How?
    hey to:
    THE SELFISH ONE, Best Wishes its easy to see the ones that STAND.Its easy to sense the PRIDE.Respect Black and White

  151. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    9:00 RT NOW MONGOLS ARE BEING JAMED UP BY LEO 12/19/09

  152. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    WHERE DID YOU CHECK THAT WEB SITE. THE FEDS TOOK IT DOWN WAY BACK. THEY WERE PUT UP UNDER SHOT GUN PRODUCTION AND NEVER WITH A MONGOL LOGO
    THERE WERE SUPPORT SHIRTS . WITH THE WORD MONGOLS AND MFFM BUT NEVER THE LOGO. AND SHIRTS WITH RESPECT FEW FEAR NONE . LEO’S LOOKING FOR A MONGOL
    HIT TONIGHT IT’S 9:30 12/19/09
    RESPECT. STEVE

  153. Anonymous Says:

    ANARCHYFACTORY-

    What the fuck are you talking about? Where do you come up with this shit?
    the website is still up http://www.honorfewfearnone.com
    there are no Respect Few Fear None shirts, there are Shotgun’s version “Honor Few Fear None.”

    And where are you getting your intell that “stand up brothers” are going to non 1%er clubs? That is flat out not true.

    Maybe you should sober up before you post.

  154. sled tramp Says:

    Anonymous,
    I see the Feds still aren’t allowing any Mongol imagery on the site.I would think now that the club is allowed to fly their colors, the use of the club’s images and so on would be allowed.
    sled tramp

  155. Anonymous Says:

    That’s not a club page, it’s Doc’s Page. It does not have anything to do with the club. Doc is a cooperating witness, so I am sure he will continue to do what the government tells him.

  156. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    your rt the link to http://www.honorfewfearnone.com is back up well part of it is my bad . that is flat true not just mongols other 1% clubs are losing members and want too be members with all the top turning. I’m not saying some clubs are not growing, like the mongols are growing that’s a fact your missing my point about stand up brothers stepping out and new one’s not stepping in. it’s a fact the intel is rt in front of you. and check it out this is not the 60′s . some of the pic’s are of feds there not coming back up.as of rt now the feds have control of what pic’s go up on web sites . about the only place you will find any mongol pic’s up will be on my space . the mongolsmc site is still down and if there smart will stay down

  157. Anonymous Says:

    ANARCHYFACTORY-
    Please explains last nights posts about the Feds wanting to hit the Mongols, you even time stamped it. ?????

    Now your saying that members from 1%er clubs are leaving because they had leaders turn on them, but your last post said that they were leaving because the Feds were going to shut down all 1%er clubs, so members were leaving and joining non 1%er clubs. Those are two totally different statements.

    The feds may have control over what pix are going up on Doc’s website, but they do not have control over pix on other websites.

    I have gone back through this page and all of your comments seem to contradict themselves. You have posted some saying the Mongols are done, than others that say MFFM. Than flipping again and saying you see too many new prospects and the Mongols are growing too fast. Now claiming a laundry list of things, including that LEO was busting Mongols last night at 9pm according to your posts last night.

    Who are you?? Seems to me like your just someone trying to stir up shit.

  158. sled tramp Says:

    ANARCHYFACTORY-
    You keep repeating a pattern….ala a certain other individual that posts here.The word intel has been used a bit, the style of writing is almost like you switch from well written and capable to poorly written on purpose.You constantly slam clubs and their members from an obvious slant.You obviously hate the Mongols,your scorn and contempt for the Black and White is clearly apparent.
    If I read your nom de plume correctly, it says FABRICATEDCHAOS or MANUFACTUREDDISINFORMATION.
    “the mongolsmc site is still down and if there smart will stay down”
    Now, that comment begs the question,why would you say if a member of the Black and White was “Smart”, they’d stay down?
    Hmmmmmmm…just sayin’…….

    sled tramp

  159. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    no disrespect , first never said the fed were going to shut down the 1% clubs . I said there are trying to make it hard to survive as a 1% club.Trying to get brothers not too trust each other top to bottom. when i made the statement about some brother leaving not talking about any high #’s just one or two at most from some clubs not all . but is hurting some clubs on recruiting not all but some like i stated the mongols are growing fast .you will never find where i said the mongols are done you will find where i state the mongols will come back bigger then ever. not sure what your reading . my statement about prospects was they need to prospect longer and not patch up so fast. there is no need to be in a hurry . what site do you see pic’s of the mongols and there party pic’s before the bust and of doc with his crew ? never used the word busting or the word feds i stated leo’s i guess i should have said local leo’s they where jamming up some mongols and looking to make a hit on some members in the Bell area all the info on that is not in rt now I’m sure you should know . And your rt doc’s site has nothing to do with the club, Was set up to sell books and shot gun production clothing. Not a shit starter . who am i ? the fuck trying to set up help for any mongols family with kids, that get hurt by some of these trumped charges on the stand-up brothers .
    respect. Steve

  160. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    the reason for the saying they should stay down is the less info and pictures about your club the harder for the leo’s and others to get info
    not smart ? get the fucking ego out of the way that you have to see yourself. where do you read if a member of the mongols was smart? you sure add a lot of shit that is not there.Do i have to say as a whole they would be smart . I’m just saying read it don’t add to it . JMO.
    Respect . Steve

  161. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    SLED,
    You can post what every you you want this is a free country , but to say i
    constantly slam clubs and their members you need to get off the pipe and show where i ever slammed any club or member.now your one of the smart guys on here and talking trash is not one of your things. So posting bs now doesn’t fit the picture .
    Respect . Steve

  162. Anonymous Says:

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    July 22nd, 2009 at 9:40 pm
    TWO WEEKS AGO THE MONGOLS HAD PRINTED UP 20 CALIFORNIA ROCKERS AND 20 PROSPECT PATCHES.
    FEDS RAID THE GUY WHO SEWS ON THE PATCHES TO THE VEST. THERE IS NOTHING ILLEGAL WITH THESE PATCHES . WHATS UP WITH THIS REBEL ? YOU HAVE ANY INFO ON THIS.
    RESPECT STEVE

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    July 23rd, 2009 at 8:46 pm
    Put money on Lil Rubes hitting the streets in August.And put this lil note down .
    Respect Steve

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    July 28th, 2009 at 10:11 pm
    LOOK FOR MONGOLS TO START COME BACK STRONGER AND SMARTER , PARTY THIS WEEKEND . BUT LOOK FOR RAID .
    RESPECT. STEVE

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    July 30th, 2009 at 3:52 pm
    mongol logo check this weekend stay tune
    respect. Steve
    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    August 20th, 2009 at 6:18 pm
    FLASH !!!!!!! MONGOLS ON WAY TO GETTING PATCH BACK

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    August 20th, 2009 at 6:33 pm
    AS OF RIGHT NOW THE MONGOLS ARE USING MFFM TOP PATCH AND STILL THE ” MONGOL ” CENTER LOGO AND CALIF LOWER ROCKER. TOP ” MONGOL ” PATCH WILL RETURN SOONER THEN MOST THINK . FEDS TAKING A HIT
    RESPECT STEVE

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    August 22nd, 2009 at 11:01 am
    MONGOLS ALREADY WON THE COURT CASE , JUDGE PISSED AT THE FEDS . MONGOLS PRINTING UP NEW WEARS ALREADY . MFFM
    RESPECT STEVE

    • ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    September 2nd, 2009 at 7:44 pm
    mongols maybe moving to fast , prospects coming out of every small town.
    respect,steve

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    September 19th, 2009 at 5:16 pm
    Trust me there is no homie walking around Whittier with a mongol tat on his head get real !!!!

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    September 19th, 2009 at 5:29 pm
    For rt now those are tee’s waiting for the feds next move . FL chapter gearing up .Ca mother chapter gearing up, Mongols on there way back .
    Respect. Steve

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    September 22nd, 2009 at 2:43 pm
    His gots the head ? his own fuking homies would put him down . get back on your meds . did you stop and say yo homie let me check your tat ? fuking bs

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    November 5th, 2009 at 10:17 pm
    WORD IS THE MONGOLS WILL START FLYING COLORS NEXT WEEK. WHAT DO YOU SAY REBEL ?
    RESPECT, STEVE

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    November 6th, 2009 at 8:43 pm
    AZ, FL AND CA CHAPTERS ARE GEARING UP WAITING WORD FROM THERE LAWYERS. MAY COME BACK BIGGER. HEARING DOC CHAVAZOS BROTHER HAS HIT THE STREETS. OOPS SORRY ABOUT THE CAPS
    RESPECT, STEVE

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    November 13th, 2009 at 1:14 pm
    Mongols are back will start flying colors this weekend !!!!!!!!!!!!!! fuk the feds

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    November 13th, 2009 at 1:31 pm
    mongols colors are flying again starting 11/13/09 now you will see the reaction of the local leo’s .
    respect Steve

    • ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    December 15th, 2009 at 7:53 pm
    I’m amazed how many brothers don’t know how to cover there backs !!!
    the mongols are recruiting so fast there going to set themselves up again.
    there are things to look for and there are rules , there are places to have meeting and then there are places not to have meetings . don’t fuk around other chapters in closed meeting unless u set the meeting on your terms. check your ego.new mother chapter now white on black.
    Respect. Steve

    • ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    December 19th, 2009 at 8:57 pm
    9:00 RT NOW MONGOLS ARE BEING JAMED UP BY LEO 12/19/09

    • ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    December 19th, 2009 at 9:41 pm
    WHERE DID YOU CHECK THAT WEB SITE. THE FEDS TOOK IT DOWN WAY BACK. THEY WERE PUT UP UNDER SHOT GUN PRODUCTION AND NEVER WITH A MONGOL LOGO
    THERE WERE SUPPORT SHIRTS . WITH THE WORD MONGOLS AND MFFM BUT NEVER THE LOGO. AND SHIRTS WITH RESPECT FEW FEAR NONE . LEO’S LOOKING FOR A MONGOL
    HIT TONIGHT IT’S 9:30 12/19/09
    RESPECT. STEVE

    • ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    December 19th, 2009 at 11:22 pm
    THE FEDS ARE CLOSES TO CLOSING DOWN MOST 1% CLUBS THE BROTHER HOOD IS BREAKING APART. SOME SAD SHIT IS GOING DOWN. A LOT OF THE SMART GUY’S AND STAND-UP BROTHERS ARE MOVING ON TO NONE 1% CLUBS. NO DISRESPECT JUST A FACT .
    RESPECT. STEVE

    I am going to ask one more time, who are you? And where do you get your so called Intell?

    You are claiming that you didn’t say things that you straight up said. just review your posts.

  163. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    again where do you see any disrespect for the mongols or any other club ?
    i’m asking one more time ?
    Respect Steve

  164. sled tramp Says:

    ANARCHYFACTORY,
    Not TRYING to disrespect you.Just noticing-my interpretation/misinterpretation-some things.It seems to me that what I noted was accurate.Yours to disagree. BTW, I’m one of the dumber commenters here.Thanks for the kind words though.I do think that your posts reflect a scorn for the Mongols.I quoted you directly and asked a question based on your post.You wrote it, not me.One point that confuses me is that you put MFFM on some of your posts.If you’re Black and white,please say which chapter.I normally would never ask this but after some polite inquiries this afternoon to those who would know, I’m confused as to your affiliation if in fact you have one.Just trying to clean up something for the betterment of all.And you’re right, talking trash ain’t my style.In this case however,although our versions of trash are apparently diametrically opposed,I don’t believe I am.
    sled tramp

  165. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    I’M LOOKING HARD MAYBE A WORD MISSING HERE OR THERE . PLEASE PICK A POST THAT I’M SAYING I DIDN’T SAY .
    RESPECT. STEVE

  166. Not Surprised Says:

    Steve:

    The info you’ve posted (not your opinions) is of a “privileged” nature concerning a 1% club. If you are in a position to have certain info passed along to you by a member or someone close to the club, my bet is that he doesn’t know you’re posting it all over the internet.

    Because you have been the only one to divulge this info, yeah, you’re gonna stick out eventually.

    sled tramp and Anonymous appear to have done their homework.

    Any of us posting here should not be offended when asked by other members of this small community to establish credibility. This can be done back channel or flat out.

    Like I said earlier about “T Dogg” no one stepped up for him and no one is stepping up for you.

    Now you made this comment:

    who am i ? the fuck trying to set up help for any mongols family with kids, that get hurt by some of these trumped charges on the stand-up brothers .
    respect. Steve

    If this is true, seems someone would definitely know you.

    Are you and ole lady?

  167. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    THERE IS NOTHING POSTED THAT IS OF HARM TO ANYONE . AS FAR AS HELPING FAMILY’S THAT’S NOT GOING TO BE PUT ON THE STREETS . MY EGO IS IN PLACE .
    RESPECT. STEVE
    VERY OLD

  168. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    Ok sled if using the term mffm makes you a affiliated then that is my bad i am not, just a supporter never meant otherwise. one mans trash is another’s treasure.
    Respect Steve

  169. DocB Says:

    ANARCHYFACTORY

    Some men find it exciting to hang out with dangerous men. Exciting like a moth is excited at the light of a flame. Some riteous Mongols have posted here. You’re not one of them. Don’t be a moth.

    respect Doc

  170. square verbose doc Says:

    Sled Tramp:

    I have to take issue with your assertion that you are “one of the dumber commenters here.” Having read a number of your posts, my take is that you may be more wise than clever–something for which we should all aim.

  171. Muck 1%er Says:

    Ok Steve, I’ve read enough. If you want to be a supporter of my club, that’s fine. That is not done by coming on a public forum and trying to impress everyone by your “supposed” knowledge of the inner workings of the club.
    You are the one who brought up the “charity work” you say you are doing for the families. Then you say your ego is in place?

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    July 22nd, 2009 at 9:40 pm
    TWO WEEKS AGO THE MONGOLS HAD PRINTED UP 20 CALIFORNIA ROCKERS AND 20 PROSPECT PATCHES.
    FEDS RAID THE GUY WHO SEWS ON THE PATCHES TO THE VEST. THERE IS NOTHING ILLEGAL WITH THESE PATCHES . WHATS UP WITH THIS REBEL ? YOU HAVE ANY INFO ON THIS.
    RESPECT STEVE

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    July 28th, 2009 at 10:11 pm
    LOOK FOR MONGOLS TO START COME BACK STRONGER AND SMARTER , PARTY THIS WEEKEND . BUT LOOK FOR RAID .
    RESPECT. STEVE

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    August 20th, 2009 at 6:33 pm
    AS OF RIGHT NOW THE MONGOLS ARE USING MFFM TOP PATCH AND STILL THE ” MONGOL ” CENTER LOGO AND CALIF LOWER ROCKER. TOP ” MONGOL ” PATCH WILL RETURN SOONER THEN MOST THINK . FEDS TAKING A HIT
    RESPECT STEVE

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    September 19th, 2009 at 5:16 pm
    Trust me there is no homie walking around Whittier with a mongol tat on his head get real !!!!

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    September 19th, 2009 at 5:29 pm
    For rt now those are tee’s waiting for the feds next move . FL chapter gearing up .Ca mother chapter gearing up, Mongols on there way back .
    Respect. Steve

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    September 22nd, 2009 at 2:43 pm
    His gots the head ? his own fuking homies would put him down . get back on your meds . did you stop and say yo homie let me check your tat ? fuking bs

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    November 6th, 2009 at 8:43 pm
    AZ, FL AND CA CHAPTERS ARE GEARING UP WAITING WORD FROM THERE LAWYERS. MAY COME BACK BIGGER. HEARING DOC CHAVAZOS BROTHER HAS HIT THE STREETS. OOPS SORRY ABOUT THE CAPS
    RESPECT, STEVE

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    November 13th, 2009 at 1:14 pm
    Mongols are back will start flying colors this weekend !!!!!!!!!!!!!! fuk the feds

    ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    November 13th, 2009 at 1:31 pm
    mongols colors are flying again starting 11/13/09 now you will see the reaction of the local leo’s .
    respect Steve

    I am very interested in knowing who elected or appointed YOU to be the spokesman for the MONGOLS MC. I’m sure Rebel will give you my email info if you want to let me know the answer to that question. He has my permission.
    This last one pisses me off personally.

    • ANARCHYFACTORY Says:
    December 15th, 2009 at 7:53 pm
    I’m amazed how many brothers don’t know how to cover there backs !!!
    the mongols are recruiting so fast there going to set themselves up again.
    there are things to look for and there are rules , there are places to have meeting and then there are places not to have meetings . don’t fuk around other chapters in closed meeting unless u set the meeting on your terms. check your ego.new mother chapter now white on black.
    Respect. Steve

    You’re a supporter, yet you’re gonna tell US how it’s done? Recruiting? I don’t know where you get your info, but to MY knowledge, MONGOLS MC DOES NOT RECRUIT. If you are not a member, it is none of your business how fast the club is or is not growing.

    You are entitled to your opinions, as this is still the USA, but when you start posing them as facts or “inside” club knowledge, you are out of line.

    Why don’t you relax and let the MONGOLS do the work of issuing “press releases” if they feel the need to make public announcements. You don’t claim yourself to be a “supporter” then cast aspersions on what you “perceive” to be club policy. Unless of course, you ARE trying to stir the pot

    I am not speaking here for my club. I’m sharing my personal opinion with you, in hopes that you will give some thought as to how you are making yourself look here in this public forum.

  172. Muck 1%er Says:

    Sorry for the second post, but I forgot to clarify my standing at the end of my note.

    Muck 1%er

    MONGOLS MOTORCYCLE CLUB

  173. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    Doc
    Some righteous Mongols have posted here no doubt !!and more will. I find it great there is a place for everyone to speak. 1% or not . A moth will fry himself on the wire
    Respect.Steve

  174. Anonymous Says:

    ANARCHYFACTORY-
    Thank you for admitting that you are not a member. Now please take responsibility for your actions. Go to the member that has been telling you private/privileged club information and let him know you have been posting club business on the internet.

    But more to more guess, you are more than likely yet another cop trying to stir up shit.

    What the Mongols do is their/our business. Not yours. And it is beyond disrespectful for you to state our business, whether it is true or your interpretation on the internet.

    This is the reason I started following your posts. This is my problem with you and your posts.

    And if your going to talk shit like:
    “Feds taking a hit”, “fuck the feds” and “will see the reaction of the local leo’s”
    and than in other posts write things like:
    “expect raids” and “LEO putting a hit on the Mongols.”

    Sounds to me like you are here stirring the pot.

  175. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    Muck well said and do respect your thoughts . this is the big part you have wrong ( You don’t claim yourself to be a “supporter”) I’m a big supporter and have stated so. But as you suggest will keep my own thoughts to myself .
    Respect. Steve

  176. sled tramp Says:

    square verbose doc Says:
    December 20th, 2009 at 9:09 pm
    Sled Tramp:

    I have to take issue with your assertion that you are “one of the dumber commenters here.”

    Thank you,That was nice of you to say. BTW, eighth grade was the best twelve years of my life….
    sled tramp

  177. sled tramp Says:

    ANARCHYFACTORY and everyone who followed this,
    A couple of months ago,I had to straighten out a family member about their running at the mouth about my life and history.This person was putting himself at serious risk by invoking my name in connection with a major club,and because he was something of a poser,Because he’s family,and to be honest,totally ignorant of the potential damage he was doing to both me and himself, I let it slide for almost 6 months.I received a friendly call from an active member of that club and we had a talk about my family member.Up to then, I had little or no idea.Then I let loose.This person was immediate family but only recently met me.Hard to explain, but he had no idea what he was doing.Anyway, I did what I had to do.This has caused a split in our relationship that won’t ever heal.This has been deeply hurtful to me.But I believe in our way of life to my bones and it’s too late for me to change.
    The bottom line here is that I’m no longer a member of a club.ANY club. But I will not tolerate disrespect to a member of, or a club of any level because in our culture,if you BELIEVE in and love our world, that’s wrong in the extreme.I appreciate and give all respect to, supporters of clubs.Sometimes to be honest, they don’t get the recognition they deserve.People have been killed by a club for wearing another club’s support gear.It can be serious and these situations while rare, should be thought out before being in the wrong place etc..
    ANARCHYFACTORY has stated he’s a supporter.I don’t know if he’s a cop or not (I don’t care) but he seems to have handled the criticism leveled at him today OK. Maybe he too, didn’t grasp the effect of his words.
    There are cops all over here,again,I don’t care.But I’m willing to give anyone a chance if they’re straight with me.So ANARCHYFACTORY, if you understand who was talking to you and why, and you want to play straight with us, I -and I’m only talking about me during visits to Rebel’s house-have no problem posting with you.
    Just my two cents.
    sled tramp

  178. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    Sled,
    Respect your two cents seems i have over stepped the line on the 1% world. Any more post from me will be only on my prospective and personal thoughts on what is going on around me, and i only have and only will speak for and from myself . I never speak for others and if it sounds if i do, my bad in my wordings. clearly no intent.
    Respect Steve

  179. DocB Says:

    Steve

    I personally don’t believe you’re a cop. I don’t think anybody else does either. If you were a cop, under this much scrutiny, by now you would have made personal attacks on everybody, about their short dicks and sexual prefrences. (!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)
    I think you are probably a well meaning guy with a lot of respect for a brother, cousin, or uncle in the club. Please know that sometimes the content of a post betrays the source without really meaning to.

    I respect that you’ve held your mud in the face of criticism without either bowing down or personally attacking anyone. I respect that you appear to have seen the light about club business being no ones business except the club. You appear to be taking responsibility and
    taking steps to prevent future indescretions. If that’s true, lesson well learmed. Sometimes the most supportive move is no move at all.

    Read Muck 1%er”s post again and we’re done!

    Respect Doc
    P.S. as always you get back what you give

  180. Doc Jones Says:

    ANARCHYFACTORY,
    A real man will admitt when he screws up and then correct his mistake. I have to say that I admire how you humbled yourself, reconized what you did wrong and not only apologized but took corrective action. I wish there were more men like you. I also want you to know that way too many idiots let their ego get in the way of admitting when they’re wrong, much less correcting their actions. You on the other hand may have some things to learn but at least you listen and are willing to do what’s right!! Hell, maybe someday you’ll be a full patch holder schooling others.

    Respectfully, Doc Jones

  181. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    Thanks for the words, yes there is times when too speak on something’s and times to suck it up and keep them to yourself, and also there are place to learn and Rebs house is one of them . No disrespect to anyone, and my own thoughts are still the clubs and there members have to change , it’s a new world and new times . The feds and leo’s have made a big change , if the clubs don’t adjust and update the writing is on the wall. This is not the 50’s,60’s or even the 70’s it’s 2010 and don’t let anyone think I’m saying any of the bothers are not smart I’m just saying they need to be smarter. Even some clubs may need to rethink there by laws adjust to something’s that can no longer be performed with their cuts on, and what is club business and what is not club business has to be clear . Clubs need to set up support systems for bothers that are busted for club business and keep the club business to themselves . bail, good lawyers ready , family support and aid when needed, and do’s and don’ts for families . Call it schooling I don’t care, it comes with the new times . Update security, and my favorite word Intel that seems to push some buttons , no disrespect just my words . Things and ppl are out there that can be put in place , of course nothing is 100 % but clubs can’t survive without change . I may get slammed for this one but there is room for a PR set-up . There are many things that can be put in place to disrupted and cost leo a lot of money and time . I’m just saying “ CHANGE “ is not all bad
    Ride free. Much respect, Steve

  182. Doc Jones Says:

    ANARCHYFACTORY,
    The cool thing about living in the United States is that we all have the right to our own opinion. What you just wrote is your opinion and you haven’t singled out any particular club. As long as you continue to not specify any club or individual I don’t see any problem stating your feelings. If it was a perfect world things would be different for sure. However, it isn’t. You’re right that times have changed and some clubs have adjusted to the times and others haven’t. I can understand both ways. You could say fuck the cops and everyone else and we’ll be who we are until the wheels fall off. On the other hand, you could say that times have changed and maybe we ought to bend with the times and change things around to fit in with the way things are now. Who’s right? Beats me!! Frankly, it’s none of my business. Either way is OK with me, as if that even matters. It’s a little like the Mongols never asking permission to start a chapter wherever they want. Pretty righteous if you ask me. Or, following protocol and getting together with the other clubs in the area and working out the details in order to keep the peace. Not a bad idea either. Which way would you go? which way is right? Again it’s up to the individual club to decide how they will carry themselves.

  183. S.J.Dave Says:

    Wow
    I hear Doc is starting a new club.”The Federalies”
    With his bottom rocker saying “RICO”

  184. BabyDave now in Indiana Says:

    Just a question , sometime before in these postings, it was said that the Warlocks had a whole chapter that was cops?? when was this ?? and was it the Florida Warlocks or the Pennsylvinia Warlocks ??
    I’m from Delaware Co. Pa. and have known several of the old timers from the 70′s of that club and lived in Orlando Fl., till quite recently and knew a couple of those fellows. And eather way i never heard about that stuff ??
    Just wondering ??
    Thanks
    BabyDave

  185. theone Says:

    florida warlocks had a chapter of cops.

  186. Rebel Says:

    Dear theone,

    And Special Agent Darrin Kozlowski was in it. Lauderdale Chapter.

    Rebel

  187. Rebel Says:

    Dear Baby Dave,

    It was Florida Warlocks. Not the Philly Warlocks. In case that was not clear. I used to know Delaware County fairly well, by the way. Essington, the swamps, the Westinghouse plant, Prospect Park, Yeadon, all that.

    your pal,
    Rebel

  188. BabyDave now in Indiana Says:

    Hay Rebel: what time frame where ya up in Delco?? I left there in 80 and moved to Baltimore,Md. Wondering if we ever met or mabey know some of the same people?? i lived in crumlynn or leaperville goes by both names back then, moved to milmont park and then to darby and prospect park. just wondering??
    Used to hang out in sun village with some bud’s my sister lived there for many a year !!
    from time to time was known to go into a bar called the damatteos,and listen to the bands also don’s bar in eddystone ??
    anyway was just wondering??

    Peace
    BabyDave

  189. BabyDave now in Indiana Says:

    Hay forgot to say, Thanks for this web site !! really cool to see that some one still belive’s in telling the truth !!
    A wise man once said let your yes be yes and your no be no !! he was just saying tell the truth and let the chips fall as they will !!
    i’ve gotten into more trouble in my life by saying what was on my mind then anything else !!
    well, ride on Brother, where the hell is spring ??
    well, bike week is only a few days away !!

    BabyDave

  190. Six Pack 1%er S.S. Says:

    Interesting reading everyone knows so much but yet they know so little.I thought the media said the Mongols M.C. were done back when they were fighting the Dirty Dozen M.C.

  191. Six Pack 1%er S.S. Says:

    Dont think i’ve ever met you Rebel anyways have a good one.

  192. Your all Fakes Says:

    Didn’t know that so many bad ass 1%ers spent their evenings blogging on the internet. Your all a bunch of poser’s, real 1%ers are out being Outlaws, not surfing google.. Punks!!!

  193. M89 Says:

    Good riddance. For the people who do not think this is a good day that the Feds can get rid of this M/C I’ll say this. This was a criminal interprise, not a bunch of fun loving law abiding bike riders. Bike riders or lawful M/Cs have nothing to worry about, the Feds have better things to do. This Doc Cavazos dude was as phony as they come, how anyone could follow that dude shows how stupid people are and how easily they can be led. About like how Chicago thug Obama got elected pres and people fainting and crap from his speeches. Seeing the dude (Cavazos) on the History channel was embarrassing and really gave M/Cs a bad image. Made them all look like nothing more than dumb murdering dope dealing thugs on bikes. When the government can find ways to make life safer for us and get rid of the riff raff like this, I see it as a good thing and not as any kind of threat to my freedom. Nuff said.

  194. sixteener Says:

    Reuben Cavazos is no biker. The five minutes it took feds to flip him and make him cry proves that. The only reason he ever got to the position he was in was because of the then Mongel Presidents four stab wounds he received from an 81 while trying to save a brother in a Laughlin, Nevada casino. While Pesident Steve Pinney was laid up healing Cavazos snaked and weasled his way behind his back and other high ranking members and stole the presidency by promising the club soldiers-(ie. followers)-better recruitment meaning a higher member count. This is when the real Mongols MOTORCYCLE Club ceased to exist imo. Rueben Cavazos had no idea what a 1% OMG was. He opened the club to his old neighborhood punk street gang the ‘Surenos’<sp?. Cavazos was handing out 'patches/colors', a true 1%er clubs most coveted posession to street punks who had never ridden a bike, had never prospected, and never been voted on by the true core members. Pinney and most of the other real brains of the club were gone by now–kicked out by Reuben Cavazos– and it was only a matter of time until Reuben Cavazos destroyed the club.
    Now the feds are gonna have tough time finding a place to put Cavazos. For those of you who really know the entire story understand what I mean. Witness protection is the only option I see for poor 'ol Reuben.. Because of his 'tantrum' war with la eMe, the Mexican Mafia, he wouldn't last a week in any prison system in the country. The MM has the power to have a freakin guard kill him for cristssakes so the feds have a problem. He wouldn't be safe in solitary. :) Reuben Cavazos is, was, and will always be a disgrace to true, righteous MC members everywhere.. He was NOT a BIKER–just a small time criminal who fell into a position to fool a group of good but misguided guys._(HINT::If your motorcycle club doesn't require you to have a motorcycle its not the real thing) :) ……southeast16

  195. Doc Jones Says:

    Your all fakes,

    Thank you for spending you evening posting on this site. It’s nice to hear from ALL the people who post on this site. Hope to keep hearing from you.

    Doc

  196. sled tramp Says:

    Your all Fakes and M89,
    Ahhhhhhhhhhh….big group hug boys.Don’t be shy….c’mon…OK, maybe watch the hair OK? I have to trailer my bike a couple blocks to pick up goils and NOTHING wrecks the hair, K?
    Your internet pen pal,
    Sled tramp

  197. REVEREND Says:

    …southeast16.

    You wrote: “(HINT::If your motorcycle club doesn’t require you to have a motorcycle its not the real thing)”

    Truth is- the assholes that want to join an MC without a bike, don’t really know the difference. In most cases, their true intention is to join a ‘gang’.

    How do you “want to join” without having hungaround and lived the life and RODE A MOTORCYCLE.

    These assholes are not 1%ers-they’re idiots and making their gangland name is more important to them than anything else…even if it includes opening the whole club world to the invasion of rats and cops!

    jb

  198. c.w. "moon miles Says:

    Thomas Jefferson said ” the government that is big enough to give you anything you want, is also big enough to take all that you have “

  199. PPD Says:

    “He made it tough for all outlaw gangs” WTF who cares they are criminals what do u expect . These people will turn on anybody to make a buck or save their own ass

  200. G Says:

    You know I read Doc’s book and I must admit I was impressed with what he said. Now I must preface that with ‘it sounded too good to be true’ and as it turns out it was too good to be true. I have been a biker for 30 years and am always on the lookout for a TRUE BIKER Club NOT a Club made up of thugs and low lifes but real men who ride and know the real meaning of Brotherhood. I have seen how many Clubs operate and most are dodgy at best and certainly don’t hold true to my idea of Brotherhood. It is not neccessary to intimidate people to appear big and tough in fact the toughest men I have ever met are the quietest most unassuming. I have never done anything to hurt another person (fights don’t count because obviously people get hurt on both sides in fights) but would consider it an honour to ride with a group of men who truly understand the bonds of brotherhood and motorcycles but i am still looking. MC stands for Motorcycle Club but somewhere along the way some people got that all messed up and thought it stood for Moneymaking Club, there is a Club I know that has Chapters all over the place but in several Chapters they have only 1 or 2 members ‘makes it quiet at Church’ but that is accepted just to appear bigtime and that defines the Club in question really. People will always bag out Clubs because they see the Headlines Biker Killing, Drug Bust or somesuch and brand them all criminals and in many cases this is true but i am sure that somewhere out there is a REAL Biker Club and one day I hope to meet them.

  201. Master Says:

    To G: If you’re looking for a REAL MC,,,,one that understands the meaning of BROTHERHOOD, I have a couple for you; The first is THE PAGANS MC – they understand what it means to be a BROTHER,,,,the second is the IRON HORSEMEN – also a great club. That is 2 that I know of,,,check them out!

  202. G Says:

    Hey Master

    thanks mate will look em up.

  203. theone Says:

    THE MONGOLS NOW ARE A WHY DIFFERENT CLUB THEN BACK WHEN DOC WAS AT TOP.. IF YOU BEEN A BIKER FOR 30 YEARS AND ITS TAKING YOU SO LONG TO FIND A CLUB TO RIDE WITH JUST KEEP RIDING BY YOURSELF.. THE PAGANS ARE GOING THROUGH WHAT THE MONGOLS HAVE GONE THROUGH YOU JUST CANT COME UP TO ONE OF THESE CLUBS AND ASK TO RIDE WITH THEM IT TAKES MORE THEN BEING A BIKER FOR OVER 30 YEARS MY FRIEND..

    MONGOLS MC 40 YEARS OF BROTHERHOOD VIDEO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJuwpB1lGpA

  204. ANARCHYFACTORY Says:

    http://WWW.FOFWEAR.COM

    MORE INFO COMING 1% SUPPORTER

  205. G Says:

    Hey theone.
    I fully understand and appreciate your comment, I didn’t say I had not been in a Club though. But my friend I do enjpoy riding alone these days or with just a mate or 2 and when we travel we like to know where the decent Clubs are so we can plan ahead. Look for events like Poker Runs & Open bar nights etc.

  206. theone Says:

    G RIGHT ON MAN RIDE SAFE MY FRIEND..

  207. sled tramp Says:

    LOOKING TO MEET A CLUB AND WEAR COLORS ON A CUT JUST SO YOU CAN BE SOMEONE IS MEANINGLESS.WHAT IT’S ABOUT IS PROVING YOU HAVE HEART.IF YOU DO, THE RIGHT PEOPLE WILL SEE IT UNDER YOUR LEATHER.

  208. southsider Says:

    fuck da mongols………. thats what they get….

  209. G Says:

    Southsider FUCK YOU you two bit idiot. you have broken the number one rule which is……….It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one’s mouth and remove all doubt.

  210. G Says:

    Hey theone drop me a line personal like gutter@sons-of-aus.com

  211. cowboy Says:

    I’ve never met the RAT B!T# doc, But i did meet and hang out with some of the MONGOLS and they’ve always treated me like a friend and had my back. My respect and support for the MONGOLS(805) will always be there.

  212. cowboy Says:

    here is a little saying I came up with and its something I always think about:

    THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF BROTHERS, THERES THE ONES WHO GO THROUGH HELL WITH YOU BECAUSE THEY WANT TO AND THERE ARE THE ONES WHO GO THROUGH HELL WITH YOU BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO.

    the ones who go through hell with you because they have to are the ones who one day will turn their back on you.

    brother to all true brothers
    COWBOY 33

  213. g_mobb Says:

    That fool doc may have cut a deal but he’s f*cked his whole life. He may b in prison. But he still has to answer to la eme who happens to control almost if not every prison in cali. So yeah 2014 aint to long frm now but well c if he makes it that long

  214. Rebel Says:

    Dear g_mobb,

    Unless Brunwin is an even bigger bastard than I think he is, Doc Cavazos will be given a new identity and a new start in life. Right now his sentencing is scheduled for March, 2011. I don’t know his current residence. I have said before I think he is up at China Lake which surrounds Area 51. I know before he flipped he was in Berdoo but that was the last Doc sighting I know about. I don’t know whether he will disappear after his sentencing or become a celebrity. I would like to talk to the guy.

    I don’t know if he has fucked up his whole life or not. I would not be shocked to see him on Dancing With the Stars.

    Rebel

  215. RedneckLCSA13ICT Says:

    All kinds of love and respect for the BLACK & WHITE in the Mongols MC Nation!!! Glad to see you Brothers stood strong and won through and after all the federal scrutiny and certain turmoil. Sorry to drudge up a year old post just wanted to send my L&R as well as support. I just stumbled accross this blogspot, but have been keeping up with what’s been going on over the past several years via the grape-vine and a few great brothers.

    Love and Respect,
    Redneck-MoFo

  216. cya Says:

    Doc, COVER YOUR BUTT CHEEKS!!! DONT DROP THE SOAP…

  217. sol Says:

    Yup! I agree with T-Dog anyone could throw a felt on their pelt and call themselves anything. What makes a club is when it is acknowledged by all!

  218. PirateBiker Says:

    http://threeblockthepathetic.blogspot.com/

  219. Skinny Says:

    I just saw the Gangster Doc Mongol episode then by chance found this link and stayed up all night reading all the comments. Great stuff. Lots of bickering and crybaby stuff with a few actually seeing the big picture of wanting to protect the biker community. My club has chosen to be proactive in this regard. As a founding member of the CMOU, we along with other member clubs stand together to promote and protect our rights. I hope anybody watching this episode will see how the MC nation can be affected by bad people and bad management. Doc is shown as not caring about the MC community but as greedy and power hungry asshole which I bet gets bigger every day. He definitely provided a blueprint for what not to do for any future MC club leaders.
    The only question I’m left with is When do I write my book ?

  220. Phuquehed Says:

    You come on here and bitch…about people “bickering”, then promote your club as if it’s gods fucking gift? What and who the fuck are CMOU?

  221. Base Says:

    Phuquehed

    Found this after reading skinnys comment

    http://cmouonline.com/

    Respects
    Base

  222. Prospect Says:

    Phuquehead, brother, let me try.

    @ skinny,
    So you are gonna take us all under your wing and save us from ourselves? That it? You are a cunt.
    I want to introduce you to Budweiser, he’s a cunt too.
    Got a feeling the first chapter of your book will start where Hunter Thompson left off. Let’s see, you could head that chapter with “how I hooked up with some Bikers and got my ass kicked.” Or, “Hickory hurts!” “Bad people and bad management!!??” Were famous for that shit.
    Fuck you. (CMOU WTF!)

    Respects,

    Prospect, 150 mother fuckin days asshole
    RBF

  223. Prospect Says:

    @ Base
    Checked out the site. So, they can’t get into COC in their state so they do an end run? Sounds kinda like an Iron Order/cop Op.

    Respects,

    Prospect
    RBFFR

  224. Phuquehed Says:

    I just looked at the site too…doesn’t fucking impress me especially since parts of their “Mission” are:

    “Create effective communication within our community, dispel negative stereotypes and improve the image of motorcycle riders in general.”

    So, effective communication is bitching about people on a site who have something to say that has absolutely nothing to do with the CMOU cunt?

    Stereotyping posters on this site is *exactly* what that asshat CMOU “founding member” did.

    And, the fucktard didn’t “improve” a damned thing with his post.

    As far as I’m concerned, he can fuck off and die and keep his circle-jerk team at home. Like Prospect said…they allow anyone in the ‘group’(?), and I’d bet money that means pigs too…and he’s trying to ‘tell’ those who post on this site as if we can’t possibly know or understand what fuckupedness Doc has done and have to have it explained to us.

    (Not ranting -at- anyone else who posted about this guy’s post, just a rant about the cmou person’s post in general)

  225. YYZ Skinhead Says:

    Wow, I haven’t seen this thread for a while. I think the Wikipedia reference ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruben_Cavazos ) to a previous article ( http://www.agingrebel.com/435 ) was what led me to this site, though it may have been the general article on the club ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mongols_motorcycle_club ).

    YYZ Skinhead

  226. WARTHOG Says:

    @Phuquehed,

    CMOU= Cops Mouthing Off Usually

    L&R,

    warthog

    FTP FTF FTW

  227. Ronbo Says:

    Phuquehed,
    Don’t sugar coat it. let it know how you really feel. Then go for a ride. This fucking idiot ain’t worth busting a blood vessel.

    Ronbo

  228. Ronbo Says:

    Warthog,
    Congrats on reaching your hard fought for goal. A good education ain’t cheap or easy.

    Ronbo

  229. Ronbo Says:

    And just who are the “bad people”? Do the run around in groups of 10, 20, 30 or more all dressed alike in bullet proof vest with machine guns and grenades? Faces covered in shame,in the middle of the night, in your backyard or…

    Nope it’s ok, it’s the police. Guess I got it wrong again.
    Good thing it’s the right yard.

    Ronbo

  230. BigV Says:

    I’m not sure what to think here. There are NC COC members who I know affiliate with CMOU, but I don’t know if THEY WOULD consider themselves affiliated or members. And it’s not my business, if they do or don’t.

    I know the NC Confederation of Clubs is a separate entity.

    I know of a “Skinny” who is affiliated with a COC club in the Piedmont region, but I’m not sure if this is the same brother. If it is, he is a well respected brother in a righteous, COC.

    Either way, I’m not sure that what he wrote was intended in the spirit it has been taken. I think the bickering he referenced is the cops, feds, shit stirrers, reporters, CI’s, and snitches that have posted in this thread trying to spread disinformation and dissension.

    BigV(Hillbilly in the Far Corner of the State)

  231. Prospect Says:

    @ Warthog
    Good on you man.

    Respects,

    Prospect
    RBR

  232. Rahlow Says:

    CMOU????
    I’m gonna have to do some askin’around……..never heard of ‘em. That don’t mean they ain’t out here….just nobody gives a fuck about em or gives em any cred.

  233. Rahlow Says:

    OK, I stand informed, friends in the area do know this CMOU,,,

  234. WARTHOG Says:

    @Ronbo & Prospect,

    Thanks, respects to you both. FYI, 332 days.

    L&R,

    warthog

    FTP FTF FTW

  235. Snow Says:

    @ WARTHOG
    a big congrats to you my friend, I’ll toast a beer to you when I get home. How’s Jim doing these days?

  236. Sieg Says:

    I dunno…CMOU looks like it would be pronounced CHOMO. Don’t think I could ride with that.

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR
    5 to 1
    SYLO

  237. WARTHOG Says:

    @Snow,

    Thanks and respects to you, my friend. If all goes as I think it will, Jim will be free tomorrow. Really looking forward to seeing his posts again. Last kite I got he sent his thanks to you and a number of other solid guys I’m proud to be friends with as well. I’ll let him take care of that in his first post back, though.

    L&R,

    warthog

    FTP FTF FTW

  238. Drifter Says:

    Warthog typed; “If all goes as I think it will, Jim will be free tomorrow. Really looking forward to seeing his posts again.”

    Absol-focking-lutely…

    Congrats as well Warthog, and thanks for the updates on Jim…

    Respects….

  239. Paladin Says:

    WARTHOG,

    Congratulations on your earned promotion. Please pass along my best wishes to Jim.

    Long May You Ride (to those that deserve to),

    Paladin

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