Mongols Case Lumbers On

November 16, 2017

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Mongols Case Lumbers On

The unceasing effort of the prison industrial complex to outlaw some people’s clothes continues. The wacky case USA v. Mongol Nation, an Unincorporated Association will continue into at least a 47th month and probably much longer than that.

Like virtually all motorcycle club cases, it started with a conclusion: That the Mongols is an inherently criminal, rather than fraternal, organization

Mongols Nation is an iteration in the war against the Mongols Motorcycle Club that began in February 1998 when an ATF case agent named John Ciccone told an ATF undercover agent named William Queen to “take a shot” at the Mongols. Queen patched into the club, was profoundly moved by the brotherly love he found and was pulled just after he went native. With the exception of a single murder case Queen’s undercover adventure didn’t amount to much.

Operation Black Rain

Ciccone and the ATF took another shot at the Mongols in 2005, The Bureau patched in four agents and another six undercover informants while four, female undercover agents posed as their women. At one point, the ATF virtually ran the motorcycle club. ATF assets controlled the distribution of Mongols patches outside California; convinced the club president, Ruben “Doc” Cavazos, to publish a memoir, appear on television and trademark the club’s insignia as his own personal property; encouraged a war with the Mexican Mafia; set up the murder of a Mongol on the Glendale Freeway; and contrived a series of drug entrapments which a federal prosecutor later described as “guerilla street theater.”

The investigation resulted in a Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations case against the Mongols. Eighty Mongols were arrested. One hundred fifty were the targets of civil forfeiture cases. The prosecution’s crown jewel, however, was the attempted forfeiture of the Mongols insignia that ATF agents had told Cavazos to trademark in  his own name.

A press release issued the day the federal case was unsealed bragged:

“‘In addition to pursuing the criminal charges set forth in the indictment, for the first time ever, we are seeking to forfeit the intellectual property of a gang,’ said United States Attorney Thomas P. O’Brien. ‘The name “Mongols,” which is part of the gang’s “patch” that members wear on their motorcycle jackets, was trademarked by the gang. The indictment alleges that this trademark is subject to forfeiture. We have filed papers seeking a court order that will prevent gang members from using or displaying the name “Mongols.” If the court grants our request for this order, then if any law enforcement officer sees a Mongol wearing his patch, he will be authorized to stop that gang member and literally take the jacket right off his back.’”

For the next nine months, ATF agents and local police confiscated not only Mongols vests but hundreds of items including club calendars, souvenir photos and Christmas cards, stickers that read “MFFM” and tee shirts that declared “Free The Mongols.” In July 2009, a federal judge declared that the Mongols insignia was a “collective membership mark,” like the Christian Cross or the Masonic square and compasses, that belonged to the club as a whole. Consequently, that Cavazos trademark had been illegal. Police couldn’t seize it, after all.

Try, Try Again

The Mongol Nation case, which was suggested to prosecutors by a federal judge named Otis D. Wright, is a way to get around the constitutional issues that now prevent police from stopping Mongols and taking the vests off their backs.

The Mongol Nation indictment argues that the motorcycle club is, as a whole, a racketeering enterprise. If that is found to be true, the government can then begin forfeiture proceedings to confiscate the club’s insignia. The real point of the case, of course, is not to try to prevent a group of people from wearing particular symbols but to force the Mongols club to defend itself in court in the hopes that the club will eventually go broke.

The point of most criminal prosecutions, as even teenagers know and as everyone but lawyers will admit, is not to decide whether someone deserves to be punished. Prosecution is punishment.

Mongols Nation was filed in February 2013 and was eventually dismissed on very technical grounds in September 2015. The government appealed and the dismissal was overturned by a three judge panel of the Ninth Circuit Court on very technical grounds last July.

The appeals judges ruled that District Judge David O. Carter, who dismissed the case, erred “in concluding that Mongol Nation and the Mongols Gang are not sufficiently distinct.” According to the Ninth: “The alleged RICO ‘enterprise,’ the Mongols Gang, is comprised of both Mongol Nation, i.e., the Mongols Gang’s official or full-patch members, and various associates” while “Mongol Nation is a subset of the alleged enterprise, which consists of legally distinct and separate persons in addition to the” Mongols gang.

So there was a pretrial conference about the case in Judge Carter’s courtroom in Santa Ana, California on November 6. And there will be another hearing in the same courtroom on December 13 at 7:30 a.m. And when this will all stop nobody knows.

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48 Responses to “Mongols Case Lumbers On”

  1. Sieg Says:

    Damn…I must have missed something.

    Well, everyone knew Robert was a pig, but that is one confused puppy.

    FTF/FTP
    TOSIAR

  2. 10GAUGE Says:

    Rebel,
    Fuck these trolls everybody here who is anybody, knows who’s who in the fuckin zoo. Much respect to you my friend.

    10G

  3. The 906 Says:

    @ Dutchboy, That definitely has a rig do it.

  4. Dutchboy Says:

    @906, The Snow Angels SMC (Snow Machine Club)?

  5. The 906 Says:

    @ Psycho

    I definitely hear you there. Not being able to hop on the scoot from mid November until May sucks. I thought about starting the 1st outlaw snowmobile club up here. Unfortunately the DNR up here is like the fucking ATF and doesn’t like anyone having fun and arrests anybody who look at them sideways. The state police here are no better.

    @ Rebel
    Thank you for your hard work. This site is one of the few things in life that make it easier for me to get out of bed every morning.

    Respect to you all

  6. Psycho Says:

    Probably not the case in this thread, but I do notice that everyone gets considerably more edgy and easily agitated up here in the great white North when the snow starts flying, the black ice starts appearing on the roads, and more and more guys start showing up at the clubhouses in their trucks.

    Fuck your feelings

  7. Paladin Says:

    From Rebel’s posted link regarding trolls:

    “Psychological studies show trolls tend to be male, show higher levels of psychopathy traits — low levels of empathy, guilt and responsibility for their actions — and higher levels of sadism traits, the enjoyment of causing others physical and psychological pain.” Seems legit.

    Paladin

  8. Iron Rider Says:

    I wouldn’t worry too much Rebel, there is always going to be trolls who wanna be keyboard warriors and like to sling mud because they have nothing better to do. The fact that Robert is ex law enforcement isn’t a surprise as his previous posting in the past leaned towards a pro law enforcement viewpoint.

  9. rw Says:

    Reb it appears to me after reading some of these replies that keyboard muscles are even larger than beer muscles

  10. Rebel Says:

    This troll, Robert, is Robert Wayne Latta, He lives in Corner, Alabama and he is retired from the Jefferson County Sheriff’s Office.

    Here is a link about what Robert Wayne Latta sees when he looks in the mirror.

    I apologize to readers for allowing this pathetic creep to barge in here like he owns the place and try to bully everybody. I just can’t watch everything every minute. If he tries to come back, I promise I will do something bad to him.

    Rebel

  11. Bradley Ward Says:

    It’s veen syggested that LE goes after so-called OMG’s instead if street gangs oyt of fear. We taxpayers and voters should ask why those resources arent put into MS-13 who appear to be far more dangerous to the public.http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/11/15/ms-13-terrorizing-american-small-towns-and-suburbs-ill-equipped-to-fight-back.amp.html

    Is it cowardace? Or just political correctbess gone mad?

    And why does the Waco indictment refer to Bandidos as OMG but Cossacs as MC yet both are accused of exactly the same behavior? (Rhetorical, no need to answer.)

  12. Robert Says:

    Rebel? Paladin? Gandalf? Figure it out guiness book of world know-all

  13. Gandalf Says:

    There is this guy at Scarbourgh Fair… “The Insulter” He’s funny. Can we keep Robert around as a pet insulter? Keep posting Robert… you keep getting funnier and funnier every post.

  14. Robert Says:

    Fuck you Paladin. Never bought you being LACSD material but I spent bunches of time over there so I know how stupid they be. Maybe you fit in. Fuck you any wihich way. Keep scaring all the sheeple with your FFL and other expertise. Gunfights? Plural? Aye mate

    https://www.facebook.com/robertwayne.latta?pnref=friends.search

  15. James W Crawford Says:

    How about ending the pissing war so we can get posts addressing the issues that affect us all?

  16. Robert Says:

    Dear Rebel
    It’s your world mate. I will move right along. Disappointed. You really gonna back that liar. I hope money is involved. Take care Sieg. I believe you are real people

    https://www.facebook.com/robertwayne.latta?pnref=friends.search

  17. Robert Says:

    Dear Rebel
    It’s your world mate. I will move right along. Disappointed. You really gonna back that liar. I hope money is involved.

    https://www.facebook.com/robertwayne.latta?pnref=friends.search

  18. El Chuntaro Says:

    1″ Vince is back! Still selling boxes of drywall for guitars. Ha! Is that you Vinnie?

  19. Paladin Says:

    @ Neuro, Robert, Rojas,

    I can’t imagine you all show your asses in public the way you do on Rebel’s page. If you did you all would either be continually in intensive care or dead. So, why not show some respect to those that post here, bring something to the table, add to the conversation. It’s not hard. You can do it.

    Paladin

  20. Freebird Says:

    I am feeling the negative waves…… Get some indoor from Oregon crack a beer and enjoy what time you have left on this earth! Ride every chance you get….

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncbEucjsNFU

  21. Aanon Says:

    While the Mongols are of topic, is there any new info on David Martinez Rebel ?

  22. Robert Says:

    Ever think about Billy Queen and Jay Dobyns. Bet if u put the truth serum to them they would say their best days were riding with their “brothers.” I bet both, especially Queen, are haunted by their betrayal. But hey we all gotta be somewhere. I stumbled here when I saw a safety bulletin that bikers were gonna kill any LEMC who did not surrender vest. That was in the wake of Tipton. Nothing happened. Bikers don’t kill cops. Generally they don’t kill anybody but bikers. Mudman is the only exception I can recall. Worked the jail when Texas Mike Norris came around. He was unaffiliated at the time I guess. Super nice guy who would’ve slit my throat if it was advantageous. He shot and killed three in a West bham bar. His coworker was acquitted. Another super nice guy. Kicked some ass whilst he was in jail. Bandido named Huddleston had a disagreement with some asshole in Bessemer. Asshole pulled gun and Huddleston took it away from him and gave him a well deserved smacking. Asshole had another gun. Shot Huddleston dead. Acquitted FTW? Yeah FTW

  23. Rebel Says:

    Dear Robert,

    I would tell you Gandalf’s story but it would make you pee yourself. Okay. I know he goes talk, talk, talk, talk. Deal with it. Okay?

    Rebel

  24. Gandalf Says:

    BTW Stop Shitting on this Story. It’s about others and important to them. Provoking fights and disrupting other stories is just plain rude. Continue Trolling me on a TPs story.

  25. Gandalf Says:

    U2 Neuro… Only a man who has done time gets upset when others claim to have done time. Hey Robert, Cops don’t do time. You and Neuro (The Cossack) seem to be butt buddies. Maybe U 2 can be cellies. LOL BTW No, I have only been here since TPs+5.

  26. Gandalf Says:

    @ Neuro, Boy you Cossacks are stupid.

  27. Gandalf Says:

    Whatever…. I’m not going to feed the trolls today. FOESAD robert the cossack. Truth Hurts don’t it? Enjoy Prison with that big rat tat on your back.

  28. Neuro Says:

    Robert, I think Goofed-off is a former poster named Vinnie 1″er. Older regulars will remember. Rebel ran him off. He got caught doing the stolen valor routine which youse mentioned.

  29. Robert Says:

    Never been to Detroit. Ain’t Big Zero. I’m Gerry Spence!! Clown. Ever feel like reminiscing, go back and read that BS about your time in the Big House. If you’re that swell with Rebel might ask him to delete that horseshit. Top of the day

  30. Gordo Says:

    Civil liberties

    Freedom of association

    US constitution??

    Irrespective of club affiliation members should be able to wear without restrictions their clubs colors
    US Constitution is applicable to all US citizens which includes 1% r’s

  31. Gandalf Says:

    And with that…. Robert is gone. LOL I must have hit a nerve.

  32. Gandalf Says:

    BTW Robert… Tell me exactly why I should apologize. Like I said before and it should have been the end of it. Rebel knows EXACTLY who I am… so STFU. I’m thinking your not a cop at all and there is a good chance your Big O Himself. Of course I’m not as sure about that as you are of me. Go Figure.

  33. Robert Says:

    And no I ain’t whining about what a tough job LE is. All us idiots know who the dangerous criminals be. Certainly not biker clubs. But keep hating. If roles reversed and biker guy was bending the law round a 20 yr stretch for one of my cop friends then I’d hate you too. But I try to do it right. Sometimes I don’t.

  34. James W Crawford Says:

    Re ironrider,

    Great videos!

    I still want video of the BATF snipers who were positioned at theundercover house firing three dozen rounds of 5.56 and .308 without hitting any of the Branch Davidians.

    Also be funny to pist video of the Portland Police officer who gravely wounded his wife in an obscenely brutal manner. Responding officers who found the woman nude, on the bed, with a singular entry wound “in the area of the right buttocks” made no arrest because they “saw no evidence of domestic violence.”

  35. Robert Says:

    Yeah I’m scared to death of 16 yr old gangbanger. So are you. So is everybody on planet earth. Tell everybody how you would infiltrate a group that speaks another language and requires newcomers to kill for entry. So the fucks settle for zapping easy bikers. Own that Mr Law and Order

  36. Robert Says:

    Right you are Gandalf. Why don’t the cops spend all their time on REAL crime Real criminals. Good question. Hard to infiltrate a criminal GANG Impossible for goofball whitey. Don’t be so hard on us pork chops. Or give us the hammer we deserve. Can’t do a god damn thing about Chicago El Lay etc so stick it to bike clubs. Still waiting for your apology for that bullshit prison tale. Prison is sort of like the Marine Corps or Vietnam (ain’t been in either). Saying you were there and you ain’t is very disrespectful

  37. Iron Rider Says:

    Sorry I didn’t realize I forgot to add this link to my post about the drunken FBI agents. This is the full video of the FBI agent shooting at the cops and his take-down

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUwBeMmnfuU

  38. Dutchboy Says:

    Wow, so many monkeys and so few footballs. What is a poor LEO to do? Let’s set up a Go fund me account to help LEOs get a better hobby than harassing fraternal organizations. Something like underwater basket weaving or wearing IO cuts and pretending to be men.

  39. Freebird Says:

    I have to wonder what is the end game? They stack the deck and take everyone’s colors. Who’s next the girl scouts because their cookies will make you fat and they all wear the same insignia.

  40. Gandalf Says:

    For example a MC realizes a member is a UC. They out Him and hire Lawyers. The C&Bs find out a member is a UC and that guy is dead meat. Bikers don’t usually kill Cops. C&Bs will kill a cop in a second. LE knows this.

  41. Gandalf Says:

    I think LE is scared to death of that 16yo gangbanger. I think LE doesn’t want to infiltrate the Crips or Bloods. Not only would they have to hire more black Officers to do it. C&Bs are harder to Chart. It’s hard to know who is who in the Hood. C&Bs change their names more than their underwear. Not to mention standing on corners and living in a shithole in the hood sucks. The Forfeiture $ is pennies and the vehicles they drive are POSs. On the other hand there are the MCs. Lots of work for white Cops to ride on Motorcycles, fuck hot Chicas and hang out in cool bars, go on runs etc. Plus Big payoff in Forfeiture and News Stories. The fact that Bikers look scary but are not as scary as they look fits perfectly into their cowardly plan. In the end infiltrating C&Bs is just Too hard, Too dangerous and No fun.

  42. Iron Rider Says:

    Have a look at these two videos;

    In the first one you see bodycam footage of an FBI agent being taken down becaus ehe was drunk and paranoid and was shooting at a cop

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HB4tD536IDQ

    Then the FBI agent partner of the FBI Agent who shot at the cop goes down to the police station to talk to the cops to get his buddy out of jail and this FBI Agent is drunk as a skunk too and armed and wearing his badge and drove to the police station, here is video of that

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-G9gjgsvbA

    You can’t make this shit up, but cops committing crimes on duty happens all the time, but you know everyone else is the bad guy LMAO

  43. Bradley Ward Says:

    http on Firefox works, while https does not (ERR_CONNECTION_TIMED_OUT).

    Trying the same thing on Chrome to see if it makes a difference.

  44. Bradley Ward Says:

    @Stevo, I agree! ATF pulls this kind of crap all the time, wasting money going after law-abiding people when they can’t even get their own act in order. Not just Waco (x2) and Ruby Ridge, but Ares Armor, classifying a piece or string as an NFA firearm, ruling that a pistol brace is “redesigned” the moment you shoulder it. All while their agents have their pistols stolen by strippers while they are in a drunken stupor. ATF is where the screw-ups go (the only worse level of hell being TSA) and that says a lot. There has been talk about abolishing ATF and I think that would be a very good thing!

  45. Stevo Says:

    So sick of it.

    Stevo

  46. Iron Rider Says:

    One of the reasons the Feds love RICO cause they can use it and drag shit out for years and years. I would really love to know what the Feds have spent so far on this case, I would be willing to bet it is in getting close to to hit the 50 mil mark because this has been going and the bills are piling up.

    Tee absurdity is that if they take the mongols patches and assets do the Feds believe that those who are Mongols are just going to stop the life and just walk away from it even if they dont have the club name anymore? I think the Feds might believe it, but it just ain’t going to be that away.

    All the money wasted on this is just so the Feds can use this case to go after other MC’s and their patches, it’s a guinea pig for the rest. I hope the feds fail not only out of spite because I think it is ridiculous how they go after MC’s when there are gangbangers in hoods who are involved in way more violent crimes, drug dealing etc that are way worse , but the Feds and cops dont like them because those 16 yr old gangbangers in a hoodie on the 6 o’clock news just arent that scary as some biker from an MC with the scary patch set.

    If the Feds had to publicly reveal how much they have spent from the day an investigation started into an MC and its progress every month until the case is done, the public and politicians would have a shit because they would look at the millions if not tens of millions of dollars being spent with no end in sight and not much to show for it and be screaming bloody murder, but we don’t see that because the Feds never ever wants to reveal those costs, that you, and I and every other taxpayer has to bare.

    Did the Feds talk Cavazos into some real stupid shit, sure but like anything other people learn from it and not only with what happened with the Mongols but other MC all over the world, and everyone is changing and adapting to make the Feds or what ever Law Enforcement agency out there aren’t going to have an easy ride when they go after the next MC, and that is good thing because no matter what Law Enforcement will keep on coming.

  47. Trebor Says:

    Everytime you turn around…

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