Following The Iron Order Murder

June 28, 2014

All Posts, News

Details of the murder of Black Pistons patch holder Zachariah “Nas T” Tipton Thursday night in a parking lot outside a Jacksonville Beach, Florida restaurant named Nippers Beach Grille continue to emerge.

Tipton, above, was shot four times in the face by an Iron Order motorcycle club prospect. The prospect’s name is being withheld by police. The prospect is a former police officer who was initially held by police in protective custody. The Aging Rebel has not been able to determine if the anonymous prospect remained in protective custody Saturday morning. The shooter has told police he acted in self defense. Informed sources speaking on condition of anonymity have said they do not expect the shooter to be charged.

Jacksonville Beach police have camouflaged the investigation in a fog of details. Police have publically implied that the shooting was motiveless and that investigators continue to interview “230 witnesses.”

What Happened

The Aging Rebel has concluded that Tipton’s death was a murder. The shooting followed an altercation between two members of the Iron Order including the anonymous shooter and probably six opponents including Tipton. About 8:10 p.m. Thursday Tipton and his companions disagreed with the Iron Order members about whether it was appropriate for the Iron Order members to display their Iron Order insignia at the Nippers’ “Bike Night” co-sponsored with Adamec Harley-Davidson. The eight men all voluntarily left the bar and adjourned to the parking lot to engage in mutual combat. No one compelled the Iron Order members to leave the bar. After Tipton bloodied the ex-police officer’s nose the bloodied man pulled a gun and shot Tipton four times in the face.

Nippers bartender Lucas Duran, who is an Air Force Reserve medic, immediately administered first aid but was unable to save Tipton’s life.  Duran told the Florida Times-Union “He had a faint pulse when we got there so we kept doing CPR and he started to get some color back but with that much trauma to the head – the bullet he took was to the right side of his head – the ability to survive that is pretty slim.”

Nippers owner Rudy Theale told the Times-Union “the incident started and ended outside and neither the victim nor the gunman were paying patrons that night.”

Iron Order members routinely cooperate with police and are encouraged to do so by club leaders. Black Pistons members do not usually cooperate with police. Consequently, most officials statements about Tipton’s murder are likely to reflect the Iron Order’s version of events.


Yesterday afternoon Jacksonville Beach police spokesman Sergeant Thomas Crumley issued the following vague statement about the case: “At this time, there are a number of people alleged to be involved or have some involvement in this investigation…. Due to the large scope of this investigation, the determination of appropriate or possible charges has not been reached at this time.”

Tipton, who was 40, left behind a wife and three children. Nippers will sponsor a fundraiser today, Saturday June 28, to assist Tipron’s survivors pay his funeral expenses.


200 Responses to “Following The Iron Order Murder”

  1. RtC Says:

    @ marine166, I didn’t use a capital “m” because I think you are a poseur
    & if any real Marines find out you are using their designation as your own,
    you’re gonna get an ass whupping! The shit you posted should be on a
    MUDSIME site, you fucking FAKE! If you knew actual facts, you would never
    have even come here, let alone post the BS showing the ignorance you
    have. IF you are a Marine(which I SERIOUSLY DOUBT) you should be ashamed.
    RESPECTS for the REAL

  2. Rusty Says:

    @Marine166, you tell me how it is that my son, who served 9 years in the Corps, obtained the rank of SSgt, then after his last enlistment, probated for and obtained his patch with an International 1% MC, is now in your eyes some sort of criminal bowing down to any one?

    You know not what you speak of. So like any good shower shoe, sit there and stfu.

  3. Rebel Says:

    Dear Marine 166,

    I think among the most annoying attributes of Iron Order is the penchant club members have for wrapping themselves up in the flag. I am also not fond of their self-righteous tirades. Most annoying is when Iron Order pissants bald face lie while wrapped in a flag and sputtering like Yosemite Sam.

    Please tell me where the Marine Base is in San Antonio.


  4. Marine 166 Says:

    Check this out all you internet warriors. Whether you want to admit it or not your pathetic weak charactor is evident to everyone by your posts on this thread. Some of you claim to be ex or current military which in and of itself is a joke but if you are why are you in?? Is it to fight for your freedoms then give them away to some scumbag who Labels himself 1%? The funniest thing about most of you is that not one of you is man enough to protect your own freedoms, it would seem you would rather have some criminal dictate to you what you can and cant wear and where and when you can wear it. And dont give me this “I respect the 1%” Crap becouse if you believe your own lie then you need to figure out the definitions of respect and fear. Its not respect that has you out in your cheerleader skirts yelling hooorrraaaa for the outlaw its cowardly fear. The same scumbags you are cheerleading for would just as soon cut your annoying head off or rape your daughter or sell a bunch of drugs to your teens as look at you. If you are such a lowlife as to support what the OMCs do then atleast have enough respect for yourself to be silent about it. Facts are facts the IOMC are a Brotherhood of men who rightly believe that they have earned the right not to be controlled by the criminal element in our society, And these same men have proven that they will not bow down and that they can and will hold there own against anyone who attempts to encroach upon the rights that they have as law biding american citizens. Respond to this however you like I am not going to bat this back and forth but for godsake take an inventory of yourself and figure out if you are really as low, worthless and stupid as your posts on this thread make you sound and if you are then GET HELP!!!!!!

  5. panamaa Says:

    citizen Says: “I have done some very extensive research and I’ve concluded that in all honesty the members of the Iron Order are more courageous than any of the people posting on this site.”

    Citizen, seems your research ability is as extensive as your deductive reasoning… Nice try asshole..

    Go fuck yourself and while your at it, fuck the Iron order too…..

  6. citizen Says:

    I have been reading all these post and my post will probably not even show up on here but I have done some very extensive research on MC’s and the two mentioned in these post I really focused on. I’ve concluded that in all honesty the members of the Iron Order are more courageous than any of the people posting on this site. They stand for what they believe in and are threateded with violence on a day to day basis for doing so. The Black Pistons MC according to my research and a few discussions with a few of their members are not even in charge of themselves but actually are supporters of the Outlaw MC which are widely know in the crime world as “very bad persons” Futhermore the members of the Black Piston MC must prove they are Outlaw Material often by taking the life of someone they do not like. I am quite sure that the Iron Order member that was attacked by this unfortunate man was aware of this fact and acted as any logical person would have and defended himself. Alot of the posts on here mention that the “victim” was unarmed. In all of my research more than half the “murders” commited by these Black Pistons and Outlaws were done by simply not stopping once the person they were fighting was down. Also in all my research I discovered that the Iron Order is responsible for 1 yes ONE death and it is the one metioned above and until further information is released on the matter the Iron Order member has been released and it has been stated that he acted in self defense. If I can figure this much out sitting at my computer then surely any average human being can figure out who the cowards are, and aren’t in this matter. I too am very sorry for the loss this poor family has suffered. My prayers are that the people who follow in his footsteps realize that if you play with fire you will be burned. Just because this was another club member, it could’ve been Joe Blow from the hardware store who carries a leagaly concealled weapon or the local pastor. It doesn’t matter who the person is if they are put in a situation where they fear that their life is in danger they have the right and likely will defend themselves however possible.

  7. John Deaux Says:

    Well said, I believe the truth of the matter is most everybody’s already been put on a side by the powers that be. By monitoring your internet searches and your phone a decision’s already been made about which side of the fence your on and will be treated accordingly.
    IMHO, if you’ve spent the day out and about and haven’t offended somebody’s delicate since abilities you’ve wasted a day.
    P C, I’ll never be.

  8. Mag Says:

    @Arctic Fox – That works out to eighty-two SWAT raids per day in the United States. 36% of them end up “nothing found”.

    That means that every day thirty American homes are purposelessly attacked by the standing army that the Founders specifically warned us against.

    Thirty American homes.


    Every damn day.

    With nothing found.

    The State has become the enemy of the People. Meanwhile the “terrorist watch list” now has over a million and a half names added in the last five years.

    Are YOU an Enemy of the State yet?

    If not, why the hell not?

    Are you its ally?

    “You may not be interested in war, but war is interested in you.” Sides will eventually be forced upon everyone unless there’s some really miraculous change in historic memes playing out in front of us.

  9. Mag Says:

    @DynaWideGlideRider – “I believe that the IO is government run “MC” that has been established to spread lies, discontent and stir up trouble in the MC world.”

    If so, then there are hundreds, if not thousands, of unwitting civilians being used as bait and fodder by the State in order to bring war to the de jour enemies of the State.

    That is disgusting, but also unsurprising and typical of tyranny. Eggs, omelette, and all that. And does not mitigate against the theory you describe.

  10. Mag Says:

    @Arctic Fox – I understand the point you are trying to make. I would say that it cuts both ways. I think that badge holders enjoy a bit of the power and privilege that comes with the LE world, and the knife cuts right back.

    Waco, Ruby Ridge and other incidents come immediately and unforgettably to mind.

    Eastern Kentucky University’s School of Justice Studies estimates that SWAT teams were deployed about 3,000 times in 1980 but are now used around 50,000 times a year. This represents a ~1,600% increase in military assaults on the citizenry. (The Economist)

    Public loss of trust in law enforcement and the judicial system is shared across the board. “Ninety-two percent of judges said police lie at least some of the time. Thirty-eight percent of judges said they believe police superiors encourage subordinates to lie in court.” (Cato Institute)

    In addition to vast expansion of military assaults and systemic perception of dishonesty, law enforcement commits violent crimes only slightly less often than the general public, with a slightly higher rate of assault – and sexual assaults at a rate more than twice as high as the citizenry. (Cato Institute)

    Furthermore this accelerating militarization, used in the furtherance of violent and sexual crimes against the citizenry, is concealed by or silently consented by law enforcement: “The code of silence also remains a troubling issue for American police, with approximately one-quarter of officers surveyed stating that whistle blowing is not worth it, two-thirds reporting that police officers who report misconduct are likely to receive a cold shoulder from fellow officers, and more than one-half reporting that is it not unusual for police officers to turn a blind eye to improper conduct by other officers.” (National Institute of Justice)

    Just as a reputation for living outside the law can bring challenges when involved in what passes for the “justice” system in the United States, a reputation for bloody tyranny can bring challenges in surviving armed citizen withdrawal of consent to governance.

    Just sayin’.

  11. DynaWideGlideRider Says:

    I want to make clear that this is strictly my personal opinion and I have no proof of anything.

    I consider myself a history buff and after reading the FAQ page of the IO website and many of the comments on here I want everybody to think about this long and hard.

    It’s a well known fact that disinformation and propaganda are two of the most widely used tools when it comes to trying to dismantle any organization.

    I believe that the IO is government run “MC” that has been established to spread lies, discontent and stir up trouble in the MC world.

    Just food for thought.

    Condolences to the family of Mr. Tipton.

  12. Arctic Fox Says:


    Rebel, I love this site. Some of the juvenile comments posted in the comment sections aside, I appreciate your writing and insight into the MC world.

    My condolences to the BPMC and the AOA for their fallen member.

    I have read a lot of conflicting information about this incident. There seems to be a gulf between fact and colored rage over the incident. So I have not comment about it specifically, but I wanted to address an overwhelming theme about the IOMC being LE and that being the reason the IO member walking away. (Time will tell if it’s temporary or permanent based on the real facts of the situation.)

    Many reader will not like to read this, but the IO member will probably have less to do with any supposed LE affiliation and more to do with the reputation of the BPMC and the AOA. While many of the posters are commenting about how the IO club is a fake MC filled with cops and citizens who have not earned their patch-in, they often overlook what it takes to patch-in with a number of the 1%er clubs and the reputation of being a patch holder with the club brings.

    The pride, camaraderie, and love between the members of the various brotherhoods is a central part of the life, but it is not the only part. Members also enjoy, and at times abuse, the outlaw mentality of living outside of straight society when it comes to interacting with people outside their circle; feeling entitled to take liberties with the safety of others. All is closely accompanied by the “business” side of the clubs and earning.

    Don’t get me wrong. I’m not judging. How a man chooses to feed his family is his business.

    What I am saying is that all activities- both positive and negative- have an impact on the reputation the clubs have in the community.

    I think it is say to say patch holders enjoy a bit of the infamy that comes with being a part of the 1% world, however that knife cuts both ways-especially in cases of alleged self-defense or stand-your-ground legal situations that hinge on imminent fear for the loss of your life when deadly force is used.

    God bless the members who have earned their AOA and BP cuts, but let’s face it, they are not angels or seen as such in the communities they live within- nor are the patch-holders of other 1% clubs.

    I don’t know what happened, but if you were sitting on a jury listening to someone claiming they were accosted by members of the Black Pistons MC and presented evidence about the reputation of the club, it is not hard to see a self-defense or a stand-your-ground statute applying to the situation.

    I feel terrible for the family of the BP member, but it is the very reputation that MCs treasure and covet that will probably allow the IO guy to walk- if he does.

    I write because I want the commenters to see that rightly or wrongly, you cannot have it both ways yourselves as you claim the IO guys do. A reputation for living outside of the law the way clubs choose to at times will hurt you every time in self-defense criminal claims without clear (or at least strong) evidence that the POS claiming self-defense was in the wrong.

    TIpton’s family should go after whomever they can to sue civilly for his tragic death. The shooter for sure. But… Who knows? Maybe that includes the IOMC as well.

    Anyway. Keep up the great writing, Rebel.

  13. Panhead Says:

    @ cyrus,

    Hmmm, “go get em boys!” Cyrus got shot by one of the gangs if I remember right. Just sayin…………..


  14. Panhead Says:

    @ Renegade,

    “You Just Go By What The Previous in bread says.” That says more about you than you know. Shut up and pull mule.


  15. jordon embrey Says:

    All please read. the saddest thing about this is 3 children loose a father at a time they really need one. Zach was a good man and did not deserve to be killed in any way, by anyone. period. Here is some truth in 1998 Sammy Safar was killed in Jacksonville. fl. by strangling death in the back of a police car by a on duty police officer for 51,000.00 dollars. Anthony Rubic Vartainain was killed by a on duty police officer in Tampa fl. it was said accidental weapon discharge. come on people google Sammy Safar and Anthony Rubic Vartanian and read these horrible stories. You might get mad, sad , or shocked all is true shocking and very sad. Most would say There are no good police out there and only bad police out there. not in all cases ,but in most peoples opinion they suck. With good reason. out of the 100 police I have come across I have met 4 truly fair honest hard working men. for some it is a job. for others it is a license to get away with anything including murder. So when is enough, enough? There are and always be cover ups and mistakes, big small and in between that is the nature of the beast, although what is done in the dark will come to light we all will meet our maker then we will truly have to answer for all our wrongs and rights good, bad and the ugly. I hope for Zach Tippton’s children they don’t go down the wrong path without a father figure or proper guidance and be a stereo type statistic and be so bitter they make mistakes and mess up there lives trying to fill a void in there lives that can never be filled once it has been stolen from them.. Meaning the loss of there father.. instead stay strong and become stronger people and strengthen there family unit and try to fight against this illegal corruption and police brutality. Also for the children of Zach a.k.a. Nasty ,if you are reading this? I have prayed for you all and if any of you need anything ever if anyway I can be of any assistance please email me anytime. Your father was a good man and his passing is truly a loss. For the oldest son stay strong, lead by example for your younger brother and sister to follow they will need you to fill some big shoes your father filled before. You can do it. Much love and respect.

  16. SYLO15 Says:

    The IO’s days are numbered. It’s a black and white world and the B&W have been in the game a lot longer than these fucking wannabe Stepsons of Anarchy douchebag mail order faggots.

  17. SYLO15 Says:

    The IO’s days are numbered. It’s a black and white world and the B&W has been in the game a lot longer than these fucking wannabe Stepsons

  18. Renegade Says:

    You all are a bunch of keyboard commando barstool bullshitters. Talking all that hate and not even knowing the truth. You Just Go By What The Previous in bread says.

  19. cyrus Says:

    Someone once told me, “the enemy of my enemy, is my friend.” Well maybe it time that everyone that has had blood in the past gets over it and unifies. Red and white, black and white, and every other color combination that isn’t a cop club.

    Can you count suckers? I say the future is ours…if you can count.

    I know a lot of the history, bad blood, fights over territory. Well, what good is all that if the cops are there to worm their way into it after you fought for your clubs right to be a club.

    Everyone needs to come to a common ground and end the LE clubs.

    I just moved to Jax from pensacola. It’s a shame to see this shit around here, but it’s just as bad in west fl. I’ve seen IO with Diamond stickers on their bikes. That seems like a conflict of interest to me, how can you LE at that point. If there is enough violence, bloodshed, public outcry. The police departments will ban their guys from flying colors. Go and get em boys. But everyone needs to be on the same page.

    Fuck the police.

  20. Solo Says:

    Would that be a backfire on these idiots. Can you imagine the entire MC world focusing to protect what hold honorable and right. I a vet. And for me you lose that honor when you do shit like these so-called cop clubs. Art of War: Passive aggression will overcome even the mightiest of enemy.

    This is NOT a call to arms! This is a call to our brotherhood! We ALL know how hard we worked to get those patches!

    Eliminate the fuckers by one of their tactics. Yeesh am I the only one that sees this.

    Money is powerfully shit and when you put our world tiogether? FUCK ME!

    No…FUCK COP CLUBS! You can do a lot of ignoring eh? Lots of money to go to resources for educating and making our world aware that this is shitstain. Eventually it cave because no one wants to have patch worth piss. It’s not the patch it’s the Man.


  21. Solo Says:

    We ALL need to rally. Put up or shut up. Let’s all TCB ON THIS! Art of War. Sun Tzu their fucking ass. Think about what this could be. Defiance in war. This IS war. Just need to attack the enemie smartly. Fuck book is not gonna cut it folks. Posturing is pointless. Can you count? No pun intended. An incredible waste of manpower and resources here.. Fuck em like they fuck us everyday! Quit the schoolyard shit and ignor them! Focus all of our resources on money.

    Art of War: “When at your greatest strength project weakness.”

    We can fuck em hard if you all would fucking cooperate with each other and focus on this shitstain together.

    Love and Respect to OUR world.


  22. Solo Says:

    Need Some Help to HELP

    Make some 4×4 patches: Black background blue circle and cross over “Cop Clubs”. Sell them here maybe? All proceeds go to all true 3 piece patch holders legal fund and support. And for times like these when our world been absolutely wronged across all clubs COAST TO COAST we have funds to help OUR BROTHERS.

    My heart goes to our fallen Zach Tipton.


  23. Jim666 Says:

    I hope you remember this all thorough your service as a law officer, whis is a word describing cops I very rarley use, I usually call you pigs simply thats what most of you are I run a web page and fill it dayley w/ news articles of cops breaking the very laws they are sworn to up hole I also took an oath when I joined my club and I have never “NEVER” broke any of those rules not once and I really am 00% sure I never will the capata of cops breaking the very laws they swear to uphold is 100 to 1 % of ! % ers breaking the same laws, go think about that you want the link so you can read what your brothers in blue are up to ? here it is, link below.

    check it out then come here and call us 1% ers criminals w/ a honest and striaght face. You cannot !

    your brothers in blue are the real thugs and gangs,
    Why anyone would want to be a part of the most hated group of people in the intire world is beyond me, maybe you might want to rethink what you want to be when you grow up. A.C.A.B.

  24. copperokie Says:

    I’ve been a police officer for 20 years. I have always believed in justice but that’s not to say it is always done by the courts. If an officer is wrong punish him if he is right support him but never cover a bad deed up. We know the rules therefore if we brake them we should be prosecuted harder than the average citizen. I proudly believe in your freedom and your rights to live a free life and because of that I don’t have many friends in the law enforcement world. I will continue to be a cop until I finally retire but I also will continue to do what is right and I am well aware that the system sucks

  25. meangene Says:

    Once again it has been proven that the largest criminal orginization in America is LEO.Once a PIG always a PIG. IO we will never forget.
    NAS T, Ride in Peace. LL&R

  26. PH BPMC Says:

    RIP Nas T BPMC. Much Love, God Speed

  27. Dilli Gaf Says:

    We ain’t a cop club but we have an intelligence pipeline second to none,” the Hoodlums’ leader told McDaniel, according to the affidavit. “I hate cops. … But I will pat them on the [butt] and rub them on the back to get every bit of intel out of those (expletive) that I can. … We manipulate the hell out of a lot of them.”

  28. AOA Sympathizer Says:

    Meh, in approximately 4 sentences you made clear that I am a danger to myself and others. Grateful. Rebel, keep it up. I am fan. I do want to offer condolences to Tipton’s family. His life shouldn’t have ended that way. He did, however, “die with his boots on.”

  29. very fye Says:


  30. David Jackson Says:

    David Jackson
    Aka jnkyrd dave, aka jnkyrd jckson
    I know who you are.

  31. Rebel Says:

    Dear Meh,

    We should talk sometime.


  32. slycechyx Says:

    Ol’LadyRider, I’ll be he is even lower then corrections, more then likely, mall cop.

  33. Just Wonderin Says:

    @Rebels Wrong said “I have been in rooms with you tough guys all alone and the minute I mention “years” to a Man YOU ALL want to sell someone out to get a deal.” He admits he’s a cop, he’s certainly angry enough and he claims to have access to investigation evidence. Is Rebels Wrong really Ciccone?

  34. Ol'LadyRider Says:

    Dear “Rebels (sic) wrong,”

    I was going to say “Fuck off, pig,” but realized from your brief rant about firearms that you’re an even lower life form. Corrections, I’ll bet, the laughingstocks of the LE hierarchy and the world in general.

    Regardless, fuck off.

  35. Gay Edgar Hoover Says:

    Seems to me LEO are getting mighty testy. I guess the whole muddy up the waters and then complain we can’t speed up the investigation any faster because people are muddying up the waters isn’t working out for you.

    Straight to making threats now.

  36. Meh Says:

    “the “threats” being made by parties of either / both sides if the equation can me traced…”


    If you use a public wifi hotspot and are not recorded by surveillance cameras etc you are effectively untraceable, and if you boot a live Linux distro on USB key, DVD, CD etc you’ll leave no traces on your PC hard drive unless you choose to write to disc. Those so motivated can also spoof their MAC address.

    There are EXIF file removal tools for those wanting to send untraceable pics.

    As RATs (Remote Administration Tools) and other surveillance tech becomes ubquitous some people may still wish to communicate.

  37. Paladin Says:

    @ Rebels Wrong

    I don’t post anything on this or any other site that I wouldn’t or won’t say to someone’s face. So, you have an open, anytime invitation to SoCal, specifically the SFV. No need to call ahead, just bring it.


  38. Mag Says:

    @Paladin – “You drain a can of corn. A clip holds papers or a woman’s hair. An ammunition retention device is referred to as a magazine.”

    Thank you. I snorted with laughter at the “drain” comment. “Draining” a magazine is an onanistic and bespittled idealization of a moment that has far more to do with pure terror and programmed response than with any sort of fetishized heroism.

    @Rebels wrong – “the fact is ‘the thin blue line’ actually lives by the credo’s you guys espouse to but can never do”

    That reads to me as an open confirmation, from a declared member of law enforcement, that culturally organized conspiracy by said law enforcement to deprive civil rights under color of authority, is in reality far more factually prevalent than the most exaggerated media dramatizations of “omerta” by motorcycle enthusiasts.

    In other words, while bikers talk about not snitching, cops actually are organized criminal fascists. I think I got ya.

  39. Whitepride Says:

    Dear Rebel, As a Pats fan myself feel free to post that IP address! As always respect to you and the other deserving!

  40. 10GAUGE Says:

    Dear Rebels wrong,

    “They were both getting the hell beaten out of them”…..we’ll according to witnesses one guy had a bloody nose. You obviously have not had the “hell” beaten out of you before, or “beaten the hell out of someone” before for that matter.

    As well there is no way this pussy “hip fired” his weapon and hit a man in the face three times and his head once! Give me a fuckin break you idiot

    So you can just fuck off

  41. Mag Says:

    @Dsve – Ego has resulted in countless unnecessary and unprofitable deaths.

    @Rebel – I imagine that your patience is often worn thin at seeing men make the same bloody mistake generation after generation. I appreciate your effort on this site. Respect also for your not being stopped by the intimacy with tragedy that some of your documentary effort requires.

  42. Rebel Says:

    Dear Rebels wrong,

    Look pal, tone your shit down or I’ll publish your home address. Go Pats.


  43. Whitepride Says:

    @Rebels wrong- You sir are a DOUCHEBAG! I and some of the men that post on here are most certainly patch holders of some REAL club or another. As far as the Thin Blue Line goes that is a fucking joke! It might have been real back in the day but as a family member of LE I hear the stories of pussy cops ratting on their brothers to get out of trouble and some just to get a promotion or suck the ass of a higher up. Ask any honest cop (if you can find one) and they will tell you that men in an MC are the least likely to rat or flip on their brothers! FUCK OFF AND DIE BITCH!!!!

    (Damn I wish I could write like Paladin)

  44. Rebel Says:

    Dear Rebels wrong,

    First of all, change your fucking handle or I will ban you. It is cool if you insult me. Just don’t make insulting me your identity. Don’t come out of the gate as such a flaming asshole. Try putting “Rebel’s wrong” in the body of your comment next time.

    Second, stop calling me a liar. I tell the truth to the best of my ability. You allege that you have access to witness statements and cell phone videos. Send them to me. I would like to see them. I protect sources.

    Third, I have fired a lot of guns. I’ve fired guns in anger. You have no idea who the fuck I am. Stop trying to wow me with your combat shooting expertise. I’m not impressed. It just makes you sound like a punk.

    Your pal,

  45. rollinnorth Says:

    So, how is it that YOU know so much about what went down “Rebels wrong”? Hmmm, smells like bacon.

    Oops, there I go feeding the troll; shame on me.

    Respect, to those…

  46. Paladin Says:

    Rebels Wrong said:

    “… the weapon was pulled and “hip fired” repeatedly any one with a minute if firearms and self defense training knows you fire until the threat is neutralized or you drain the clip..”

    Obviously; you have no firearms training. “Hip firing” and hitting an 8 inch moving target (a human head) 4 times in rapid succession is the stuff of fantasy and Hollywood. FYI; You drain a can of corn. A clip holds papers or a woman’s hair. An ammunition retention device is referred to as a magazine. Anyone with a minute of firearms and self defense training knows these things.


  47. Rebels wrong Says:

    Ya know what makes you losers hate LE? U all talk about brotherhood and how tough you are and how you don’t snitch etc. I have been in rooms with you tough guys all alone and the minute I mention “years” to a Man YOU ALL want to sell someone out to get a deal. But go ahead tell everyone how “solid” you are, the fact is “the thin blue line” actually lives by the credo’s you guys espouse to but can never do

  48. Rebels wrong Says:

    Paladin. That “threat” about the Internet not be anonymous goes both ways, make no mistake about it, the “threats” being made by parties of either / both sides if the equation can me traced… The sad part is I highly doubt anyone of you are members of any club, simply shit stirrers who want to sit and watch others pain and wait for people like me to clean it up

  49. Dave Says:

    Paladin, that reminds me of a true story. I think it made the press too, as it was amusing in a way;

    My first wife wanted to become a vet and treat horses and such, and we knew a very good vet that worked with large animals who we spoke to about what to expect.

    She talked to us about how she was called out to treat some exotic animals at a private reserve in Texas. Amongst these was a tiger. While she was there, she asked why the owner had called her and he said the last vet referred him to her as the last vet would not be able to treat the tiger. When she asked why, he informed her that the vet and his team were trying to move the tiger after it had been drugged and the vet had grabbed the tail of the tiger which, even drugged, caused it to reach back and swipe. Either it was coming out of the meds, or going into them, but the tiger apparently was not happy about having its tailed pulled and let the vet know. The vet had been taken to a hospital to be treated and they needed someone else who was trained and familiar with exotics and she was one of those few that people know.

    In concluding, she turned to my wife and stated “So now you know… Never pull a tiger’s tail because they don’t like it.” Her face was so ‘this is important, not a joke’… it made us laugh… she kept saying “seriously…. don’t do it…” which only made things worse.. eventually she was laughing too.


    When someone takes another’s life, it’s nothing to be proud of. It means that someone couldn’t handle the matter in any other way than to take a life in order to “win” the disagreement. I carry, but I’ve never had to use my gun as I can often backhand the average guy into next week. I don’t need to fight, I don’t need to kick. I would rather not have to engage in physical violence. But the important thing to remember about people who would rather not do something is that it doesn’t mean they don’t know how.

    Perhaps stepping outside was the wrong thing to do, for both parties, but it’s moot now ain’t it. So many guys want to be tough, so when disagreements happen they decide that in order to be a man they need to punch someone in the face.

    Yeah… That makes you a man. Just like punching your wife in the face makes you a husband, or punching your kids in the face makes you a father.

    I don’t agree with everyone here. I don’t like everyone here.

    But at least I can agree that we disagree and then sit down and have a beer with them.

    I hope the next time someone enters a disagreement, they pause and think about what matters to them before esculating the issue. Sure you’re tough. I don’t doubt it. But what will your family do while you’re serving time, or worse… While you’re dead?

    Save your anger for things like government oppression, foreign invasions, and terrible tv shows.

    I don’t know any of you, but what would I have to read if you were gone? Who would shoot the shit with me? Who would help me fight Big Brother? And I’m not talking to the douchebags… You guys know who I mean.

  50. Paladin Says:

    Mag said:

    “They have a plan to ride the tiger. That is not the same as riding the tiger.”

    To quote the late Tom Clancy; “If you want to kick the Tiger in his ass, you’d better have a plan for dealing with his teeth.”

    Long May You Ride,


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